In a Perfect World - Shooting Sports Forum


Ruger Mini-14 and Mini-30 Ruger Mini-14 and Mini-30 family of rifles

Like Tree57Likes
  • 6 Post By Beck
  • 4 Post By 2rangers
  • 4 Post By kwg020
  • 5 Post By Beck
  • 5 Post By MOTOROLANUT
  • 2 Post By kwg020
  • 6 Post By jumpluff
  • 4 Post By 40nascar
  • 5 Post By Beck
  • 5 Post By 40nascar
  • 3 Post By 40nascar
  • 2 Post By Bolero
  • 1 Post By Bolero
  • 1 Post By dh1633pm
  • 1 Post By Bolero
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-04-2020, 17:29   #1
Glass Half-Full Member
 
Beck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Suddenly
Posts: 1,376
In a Perfect World

RANT

In a perfect world I could send messages to Gunbroker sellers who are taking advantage and selling ammo a 4+ times the price, and tell them to stick it up their a$$e$ without risking getting my GB account suspended.

At this point I'm entering names of opportunistic sellers into a database I will check in the future when looking at Gunbroker items. I'm makin' a list, checking it twice.

What this forum needs is a "Wall of Shame" section where we could warn our friends about bad GB sellers and other businesses.

I'm leaning more towards cutting ties with SG Ammo. When I first started buying the Vympel Red Army Standard 7.62x39 and announced to this forum that it was available, and the same as Golden Tiger, I was getting a better deal at Outdoor Limited... lower cost and lower shipping. LAX was also less expensive than SG.

When SG recently responded to a message I sent they claimed that before the Corona crisis they where making a clean profit of only $7.00 from a case of Red Army. I call Bullshirt! What, do they think I was born yesterday? So was Outdoor Limited making something like $5.00 profit per case of 1000. I don't think so.

Since the run on ammo SG's Red Army x39 has gone up $60.00 per case of 1000. Golden Tiger has gone up $70.00 per case of 1000. I smell opportunism. The price of fuel has plummeted so transportation costs should be lower, which should give ammo dealers some relief they could pass on to us. The numbers make no sense. IMO the way many vendors are behaving is criminal.

After the smoke clears and the crisis is over maybe some people should go to jail. After all, the President and many state governors have declared guns and ammo businesses "Essential" during the crisis.

/RANT
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
John 15:13
Beck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2020, 17:40   #2
Full Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: out in the country..1,327 meters from nearest neighbor
Posts: 2,645
I remember cheaper than dirt doing the same thing after sandy hook, I believe.
__________________
Rangers lead the way-All the way.
2005 series 1 co-champion-scope class- in the brotherhood of true marksmen.
2005 series 2, modded barrel class champion-
MOA club member
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2rangers is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2020, 18:20   #3
Full Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,986
It's a free market. Well, pretty much so. Others will call it capitalism. I choose to reload and avoid the drama. I buy when times are good and go to ground when they are not. I stopped doing business with cheaper than dirt after what they did before the election. I may be on a fixed income but I am not destitute so I do have some control over where my play money goes to. When things go to hell in a hand basket, be prepared to dig deep into the pocket. I just wish I had a gasoline barrel in my driveway to fill up.

kwg
kwg020 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Old 04-04-2020, 21:38   #4
Glass Half-Full Member
 
Beck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Suddenly
Posts: 1,376
Yep, Capitalism is a good system, and we have laws against price gouging, which many people have been arrested for since the crisis worsened. We have checks and balances.

I've got more ammo than I need. I could be on there price gouging, selling off some excess. Why don't I? Because I'm not made of the filth those people are.

I think it was Chris Kyle's dad who told him there are three types of people in the world. 1) Sheep 2) Wolves, and 3) Sheepdogs.

I'll be a sheepdog 'til the day I die. Wolves are my natural enemies.
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
John 15:13
Beck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 05:40   #5
Full Member
 
MOTOROLANUT's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2016
Posts: 174
SG double charged my account about 4 years ago and cost me overdraft fees. They refunded the overcharge but NOT my fees and not so much as a freaking sorry. The price gouging and increased shipping fees does not surprise me. Primary Arms, Lucky Gunner, Target Sports, AIM Surplus, PSA, Sportsmans Guide, Natchez, Midway, Brownells and the list goes on not only for ammo but for magazines too.

Its a crying shame we are plagued by unscrupulous vendors such as these. It reminds me of those folks who bought generators and quadrupled the price to hurricane survivors.

Glad I bought cheap and stacked deep long ago. If I live to see this pandemic end, hopefully after the re-swearing in of the orange man thing will get back to normal.
kwg020, 2rangers, 40nascar and 2 others like this.
MOTOROLANUT is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 07:02   #6
Full Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,986
One of the things I don't like and I see happening is the rampant over sensationalism of the press. I also wish Mr. Trump would be quiet about any of the Covid-19 and let Mike Pence do the talking. I know Mr. Trump needs to be re-elected but I think he would be doing himself and America a favor if Mike answered the questions. The liberal press focuses on Mr. Trump and every word he says and that is causing a portion of the problem. Hype and fear is the end result. Mike is a no nonsense kind of guy and America needs that right now.

kwg
40nascar and nickelplate like this.
kwg020 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 09:06   #7
Full Member
 
jumpluff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: southern Indiana
Posts: 682
I vote with my dollars. If you have an unfair price....I will keep my dollars in my pocket.

If you are a moral and righteous vendor...I will remember you...and I will support you. Treat me right...I will return the favor.

I have no problem with a vendor making a profit.

Profiteers are another matter. I will shake the dust off my feet and move on down the road.

And...for the record...I will make it a point to never darken such doorways again...
kwg020, 2rangers, 40nascar and 3 others like this.
__________________
The dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air, and so we shall always be with the Lord.
jumpluff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 11:06   #8
Full Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 301
Originally Posted by Beck View Post
RANT

In a perfect world I could send messages to Gunbroker sellers who are taking advantage and selling ammo a 4+ times the price, and tell them to stick it up their a$$e$ without risking getting my GB account suspended.

At this point I'm entering names of opportunistic sellers into a database I will check in the future when looking at Gunbroker items. I'm makin' a list, checking it twice.

What this forum needs is a "Wall of Shame" section where we could warn our friends about bad GB sellers and other businesses.

I'm leaning more towards cutting ties with SG Ammo. When I first started buying the Vympel Red Army Standard 7.62x39 and announced to this forum that it was available, and the same as Golden Tiger, I was getting a better deal at Outdoor Limited... lower cost and lower shipping. LAX was also less expensive than SG.

When SG recently responded to a message I sent they claimed that before the Corona crisis they where making a clean profit of only $7.00 from a case of Red Army. I call Bullshirt! What, do they think I was born yesterday? So was Outdoor Limited making something like $5.00 profit per case of 1000. I don't think so.

Since the run on ammo SG's Red Army x39 has gone up $60.00 per case of 1000. Golden Tiger has gone up $70.00 per case of 1000. I smell opportunism. The price of fuel has plummeted so transportation costs should be lower, which should give ammo dealers some relief they could pass on to us. The numbers make no sense. IMO the way many vendors are behaving is criminal.

After the smoke clears and the crisis is over maybe some people should go to jail. After all, the President and many state governors have declared guns and ammo businesses "Essential" during the crisis.

/RANT
wouldn't you think the best thing to do is not to post on the internet when you see a good deal?
SPQR70AD is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 13:29   #9
Temp Banned!
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Natagua
Posts: 6,258
Originally Posted by 2rangers View Post
I remember cheaper than dirt doing the same thing after sandy hook, I believe.
Yep, I remember when they (CTD) were charging over $1.00 per rnd for 5.56, 7.62x39 and .223 after the last ammo pandemic. I haven't hardly visited their site in years. I may check in today for a good laugh, and to find out what my ammo investment is worth now.
2rangers, jumpluff, Beck and 1 others like this.

Last edited by 40nascar; 04-05-2020 at 13:31. Reason: Autocorrect error
40nascar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 14:18   #10
Glass Half-Full Member
 
Beck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Suddenly
Posts: 1,376
Originally Posted by SPQR70AD View Post
wouldn't you think the best thing to do is not to post on the internet when you see a good deal?
Your reply has nothing to do with my original post. But while we're on the subject... no I don't think that way. If I didn't have any ammo or didn't have enough ammo, I would buy some if I saw a good deal. Then I'd tell my friends where it is so they could get some too.

People who find a good deal, and buy it all for themselves to sell for several times the price are cut from the same cloth as rapists and child molesters.

But why do you care, SPQR70AD? You're a prolific ant-gun Internet troll.
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
John 15:13
Beck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 15:10   #11
Temp Banned!
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Natagua
Posts: 6,258
Originally Posted by SPQR70AD View Post
wouldn't you think the best thing to do is not to post on the internet when you see a good deal?
I wouldn't tell the world, but i would let my P.U. and personal freinds know about it!
2rangers, jumpluff, Bepe and 2 others like this.
40nascar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-05-2020, 15:34   #12
Temp Banned!
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Natagua
Posts: 6,258
Originally Posted by 2rangers View Post
I remember cheaper than dirt doing the same thing after sandy hook, I believe.
Just checked in with Cheaper Than Dirt. Here are current prices on 7.62x39 ammo:

Tula - 67.25 cents per rnd.

Brown Bear subsonic - 77 cents per rnd



Buy now while its cheap!
2rangers, Bepe and SMOGGUY like this.

Last edited by 40nascar; 04-05-2020 at 15:36. Reason: Autocorrect error
40nascar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 08:41   #13
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 595
We just lived through several years of the cheapest prices/best availability of ammo, reloading supplies, pistols, and AR style rifles. Why don't you have 10,000 rounds or more squirreled away?

Is this your first panic-buy environment? If it is, make it your last once things settle down.

I sounded just like you back in 1994, so I understand.

EDIT: sounds like Beck is prepared. However...

In a time of shortage, what is "price gouging?"
40nascar and Bepe like this.

Last edited by Bolero; 04-06-2020 at 10:03.
Bolero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 14:10   #14
Glass Half-Full Member
 
Beck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Suddenly
Posts: 1,376
Originally Posted by Bolero View Post
We just lived through several years of the cheapest prices/best availability of ammo, reloading supplies, pistols, and AR style rifles. Why don't you have 10,000 rounds or more squirreled away?

Is this your first panic-buy environment? If it is, make it your last once things settle down.

I sounded just like you back in 1994, so I understand.

EDIT: sounds like Beck is prepared. However...

In a time of shortage, what is "price gouging?"
I was ready in 1994 too. I was a survivalist then, before the term "Prepper" was being used. Food, solar and wind power, a whole-house battery backup system I designed and built, guns and plenty of ammo for all of them. I was ready for any surprises, whether that would be a winter storm or summer storm with extended power outages, zombie invasion, Armageddon, etc.

Price gouging is against the law in every state. The California Attorney General's office defines it as:

"Sellers trying to take unfair advantage of consumers during an emergency or disaster by greatly increasing prices for essential consumer goods and services." The federal government and many state governors have declared firearms and ammo essential.

Other states have similar definitions. Punishments range from fines to prison time for convictions, depending on the state. It's also a federal crime.

Capitalism is not a free-for-all. There are laws that regulate commerce. People have already been arrested for criminal price gouging during this crisis, and I think a lot more businesses and individuals will find out later after the smoke clears that they have broken the law. If everyone filed complaints with their state Attorney General I'm sure prices of ammo would come down sooner than later.

Price gouging is just another manifestation of the opportunistic criminal mind. People's behavior in times of emergency and crisis tells us a lot about their character.

As for me, I would give friends ammo for free if they had none and I could get it to them. It's not only the decent thing to do, it's tactically practical and wise. I may be an army of one, but I can't shoot enough of the thousands of rounds of ammo I have by myself should this crisis or another crisis turn into massive civil unrest. I want my allies to be locked a loaded as well.
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
John 15:13
Beck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 14:18   #15
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 595
"The California Attorney General's office defines it as..."

Hahahahahaha

Ah yes, California.
40nascar likes this.
Bolero is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 14:33   #16
Glass Half-Full Member
 
Beck's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Suddenly
Posts: 1,376
Originally Posted by Bolero View Post
"The California Attorney General's office defines it as..."

Hahahahahaha

Ah yes, California.
You can pick another state AG, and as I said the laws are basically the same. How a state enforces it or not is another issue. California would more than likely use the law to shut down gun dealers. That's another danger suppliers should be aware of. Price gouging on ammo could have state price gouging laws turned into yet another anti-gun tactic.

So I hope the price gougers are laughing all the way to the bank, because in some states it may be their last run to the bank.
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
John 15:13
Beck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 14:58   #17
Full Member
 
dh1633pm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Central New York
Posts: 6,871
Gouging although not pretty is just capitalism doing its thing. Supply and demand. If demand goes up and supply down prices go up. If supply goes up and demand down then you get the idea. By gouging they are encouraging others to enter the market. When others join the market prices start to go down. Better to hold off buying until the panic has died down a bit. Doesn't help if you have an empty rifle. And yes it still sucks.
40nascar likes this.
dh1633pm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 15:10   #18
Full Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: N. Calif
Posts: 233
Originally Posted by Bolero View Post
...In a time of shortage, what is "price gouging?"
From my perspective, the "shortage" is being created by panic buyers. A more than typical amount of buyers attempting to purchase a more than typical quantity of a product in a short amount of time.

I see no reason how that significantly affects the cost of production, shipping, and sale, compared with pre-panic costs.

Unless the factories, distributors, and retailers are investing in ramping-up production, distribution, and increasing sales staff/facilities to meet the higher demand, it is pure profiteering.

I never have, nor will I ever buy anything from "Cheaper Than Dirt". I prefer to patronize Midway USA, Powder Valley, Graf's, Natchez, Bud's, and similar vendors.
firescout is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-06-2020, 17:42   #19
Full Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 595
Perhaps the government should create a crisis, and then step in and impose price controls.

Here is a link to the short version. Enjoy.


https://cdn.mises.org/Road%20to%20serfdom.pdf
40nascar likes this.

Last edited by Bolero; 04-06-2020 at 18:04.
Bolero is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:47.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Friendly URLs by vBSEO 3.6.1
vBulletin Security provided by vBSecurity v2.2.2 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
All information is copyright by Perfectunion.com unless already under copyright.