Marlin 1895 and Recoil - Shooting Sports Forum


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Old 08-20-2020, 20:09   #1
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Marlin 1895 and Recoil

Howdy,

I know it depends on load and rifle, and it can be very subjective, so it's very hard to answer a question like "How does the .45/70 recoil?"

But, what about a more specific question? In a Marlin 1895, 18-inch... what is considered a "comfortable" range load versus a "hot" elephant-killing round?

I've heard 300 to 405g bullets going 1,000 to 1,500 fps pound the shoulder less than a 12g shotgun. Others say only the 2,000 fps and up are the real recoil monsters.

So, to those who own an 1895- what factory ammo would you recommend for some comfortable range shooting?

Thanks!

(For a frame of reference, I have shot 5.56, 7.62 Russian, .30-06, .303 and 8mm Mauser in various rifles...)
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Old 08-23-2020, 05:24   #2
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I used some factory ammo in my 45-70 Marlin 1895G, but mostly reload. I have tried Hornady and Remington only. Both are not exactly lite loads.
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Old 08-24-2020, 04:25   #3
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300 grains to 1500 fps, and 405 gr. To 1300 fps. Are roughly equivalent to a full power 240 gr full power 44 magnum load in a lever gun, except the 405 gr load is more of long push than a fast punch.
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Old 08-24-2020, 13:42   #4
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Thank you sir.

That's exactly the firsthand, practical info I was looking for.
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Old 09-29-2020, 12:00   #5
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The Marlins are relatively light guns. (7 lbs) If you push them you will get hit.

Conversely a Win 1886 weighs 9 lbs and is alot more pleasant to shoot as long as it doesn't have a Crescent Butt Plate.

I have an 1895 CB 26" .45-70 and a 1894 CB 24 in .44 Spec/Mag. The .44 weighed 7 lbs 6 oz and the 1895 was 7 lbs on the nose?



I installed a 1" thick Pachmayer Recoil Pad on both guns. Really helped on the .44 but not so much on the .45-70. So I installed a Gray Coil Recoil Reducer in the stock, which brought the weight up to 8 lbs and actually did help..

With 325 gr boolits and 33 gr of 5744 I got an acceptable Trajectory and I can fire 50 rounds in a morning and not hate myself. These are running 1550 fps and would be suitable for anything up to Elk. I use it for Short Range Silhouette.

405 gr boolits at 1300 fps would also be acceptable, and better for Elk or Moose. I could push those boolits up to 1500-1600 fps and live to tell about it as I'd only be firing a few in any given outing.

Anything above those numbers like with 500 gr boolits or 2000 fps are going to hurt you. you won't be shooting accurately with those loads.

Shooting these guns without at least a serious Recoil Pad is foolish. They are light guns, and don't resist Recoil like heavier guns do..

Randy
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Old 09-30-2020, 18:47   #6
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I downloaded my .45-70s and now a .45-60 using a 292 gr .457 lyman bullet that I cast. Had an 1895, two Rolling Blocks, an 1886 and now a uberti 1876 NWMP carbine. If your going to load them hot put a kick eaze or shotgun pad on your rifle. Your shoulder will thank you.
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Old 10-06-2020, 08:18   #7
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At last...

I finally had a chance to put some rounds through my 1895! And for the most part, I would have to say I agree with what I heard from some other .45/70 owners.

I shot three loads: Fiocchi "Cowboy" loads (405g @ 1,185), Federal Power-Shok (300g @ 1,880) and Hornady Subsonic (410g @ 1,075).

Not surprisingly, the Federal was the only load I found uncomfortable. And they weren't too bad, just wouldn't want to shoot a box full.

Both the Hornady and Fiocchi were pussycats in my opinion; they felt less punishing than average 170g .30-30s. I shot several boxes of them and they grouped very well, mostly in clumps at close range- sweet.

I was shooting a Marlin 1895 GBL, 18-inch, with factory recoil pad. I shot both standing and from a bench. Overall, I would say, I am really pleased with the 1895 and I'm glad I purchased it!
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Old 10-06-2020, 09:01   #8
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Anything going about like 1600 or so is going to kick harder. Around 1000 to 1200 are going to be fairly easy going rounds. I love my 1895G.
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Old 10-06-2020, 11:01   #9
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Almost forgot to add...

Another thing I had heard and would now agree with, regards the nature of the recoil. I heard many guys say it's "more of a push or shove than a punch." Say what? Obviously, that's pretty subjective. But now that I've tried it, I would agree.

I was impressed by the blast and muzzle rise, compared to many other calibers. But the recoil is just not as "sharp" as say a Mosin (7.62x54) or short Mauser (8mm). It's more tolerable.

Too bad I can't get me a case of cowboy loads for $10 a box now! $$$$$$$$
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Old 10-13-2020, 11:22   #10
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Lex: You really need to look at Reloading and Casting Boolits for your .45-70. That way you can tailor any load to your rifle, and tweak it until it does what you want.

With hand loading you can bring out the true versatility of the caliber, which literally can go from Mild to Wild by just changing the ammo.

The Marlin Rifle can take anything you can stand to shoot.

Cast Boolits from 300 to 500 gr, loaded from 1000 fps to 2000 fps will take any animal on this earth, as well as many light pick up trucks..

Reloading truly shows why this caliber is more popular now than ever before. My gun has never had a factory round fired in it, and neither has my 1894 CB .44 Mag.

I just happen to make the Worlds Finest Portable tool for doing this.

www.buchananprecisionmachine.com

Also information gleaned from this website, Cast Boolits will help you get started and guide you down the path to success. There is a Leverguns forum there along with just about anything else you can shoot.

However if you truly want to hunt big game and don't want to reload then a trip over to Garrett Cartridges will show you some ammo that will knock down anything. Not cheap, but definitely effective from your gun.

This is where Dino hunters go for ammo! www.garrettcartridges.com

Good Luck

Randy
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Last edited by W.R.Buchanan; 10-13-2020 at 11:41.
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Old 10-13-2020, 11:26   #11
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I'll keep that in mind. Thanks!
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Old 10-14-2020, 03:50   #12
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My comfort limit with the 1895 is a 350 grain Hornady soft point at 1650.
Any heavier or faster and it ceased to be pleasurable.
I have put pads on several of them, but this last one I resisted doing it.

The above was my hunting load when I lived in Montana, but for general range use it was an Oregon Trail 405 grain at 1200 fps.
I moved to Montana in 1980 and the area around Jellystone Park was my permanent home for nearly 40 years. I was away on deployments for some of that time but always tried to get back home to do some hunting.

This last shorty 1895 shown here was a Remlin but had better polish and bluing than some of the older Marlins I've owned.



When I moved from Montana to Arizona 2 years ago, grizzlies and moose weren't on the menu anymore, so I sold my 1895, Ruger large frame Bisley .45 and a M77 in .338 Mag.
Here I make do with an older JM Cowboy in .45 and a Uberti in .45:

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Old 10-14-2020, 04:47   #13
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Awesome pics. Thanks for sharing.

I have seen some fine "Remlins" too. And, as others have pointed out, they weren't always perfect pre-Remington, although they may have had deeper bluing, etc.

I love the stock on that last pic. Is that just a factory finish with some tongue oil or something rubbed on?

I would like to get a pistol caliber lever gun too but they are hard to come by at the moment. The only ones I have found are brand new Henrys, selling for $1,000! I'm more in the market for a Marlin .357 or .45 Colt in the $400-$500 range!
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Old 10-14-2020, 10:41   #14
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Tony: That 1895 Short Rifle with the Round Barrel is an unusual gun. I have seen only one other 1895 Short Rifle and it had an Octagon Barrel. I really wanted it but I already have the CB with 26" barrel and couldn't really justify another gun in that caliber.

Remlin was producing guns in batches and sometimes did unique ones in limited numbers like yours and the one I saw. They become hens teeth fairly quick which is good for the brand overall.

You know the Northern part of AZ, north of Flagstaff, up by the Grand Canyon produces some pretty big Elk?

Randy.
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Old 10-14-2020, 15:57   #15
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Not a round barrel Randy, but an octagon CBA, a "Cowboy" with 18 inch barrel.
I can see where some would think it a round barrel, as the new Marlin worker under Remington that polished the barrel must have been a Gorilla, or fell asleep at the polishing wheel. The flats on some of the Remlin octagon models have excessively rounded edges.

That rounding off of the octagon edges, and sharp loading gate edges were my main complaint with the Remlins. (And mismatched wood on some of them).
But to be fair, even the older JM Marlins had loading gates that needed smoothing.

Lexington, that JM Cowboy in .45 Colt did have some nice wood that appeared to be an oil finish. The color was a pleasing honey/Pecan color.

I worked the last two years before Covid happened, hauling water to some of the Grand Canyon lodges. I emptied potable water into a 1/2 million gallon tank in the forest just outside of Tusayan village. I put out a 200 gallon plastic bin for the elk to drink out of, and saw some big ones come to drink.
Funniest thing was a large calf that would run for the tank and jump in, and lay there for a while.
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Old 10-14-2020, 19:19   #16
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"Marlin worker under Remington that polished the barrel must have been a Gorilla, or fell asleep at the polishing wheel."

LOL
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Old 10-15-2020, 00:09   #17
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Then that makes 2 I've seen. I'll tell you that even with the Pics blown up to full size the barrel still looks round. The wood on that gun also looks very close to the wood that was on my 1895 CB IE; just above Fence Post Grade. Strait grain virtually no character.

Here's a pic of mine after Refinish.


The stock on my 1894 (below) actually did have some character that was exposed after I removed all the "Marshield" from the wood.



I think your 1894 would look nice with the Factory goo Removed and replaced with a decent Oil or even Polyurethane finish. You're into refinishing aren't you? It might be a good project for this winter.

Also Brian Pearce has some loads for .45 LC that are right up with the .45-70 up to about 350 gr boolits. That rifle will take any thing that My .44 will will put a 260 gr SWC clean thru an Elk in any direction at 900 fps, so 1600 fps will damn sure do it.

I don't think you are under gunned for your new home.

Randy
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Old 10-15-2020, 05:23   #18
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Nothing wrong with wood that is perfectly straight grain but plain, it is strong. Those stocks you sometimes see with grain that dives off at the pistol grip can break right there if subjected to stress.
More pics of an older 1895 CBA I had:



Since we are talking about Marlins, here is one that I resurrected.
A neighbor had hunted with an old Glenfield 30-30 one year and put it away in a damp case.
When he took it out it next fall it was covered in surface rust. He didn't want it anymore and gave it to me.

I removed most of the rust with oil and steel wool, then sent the barreled action to Jesse Ocumpaugh in Oregon and he rechambered/rebored it to .356 Winchester.
When I got it back I sandblasted it and finished it in Grey Cerakote.
The old cheap Birch stock was water damaged so I replaced it with a new Deluxe Walnut stock from Marlin ($200).
For about $450 total I ended up with this:

I normally dislike scopes on lever guns, but this was going to be my "long range" lever deer gun, and I wanted to do what it could do.
First load I tried in it with the Hornady 200 grain FTX was shooting 3/4 MOA.
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Old 10-15-2020, 09:25   #19
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I got my 1895G back in 2003. I was serving in Iraqi Freedom and keep thinking about how I was going to spend all my tax free money. Also had severance payments from work who felt guilty about letting me go the day I got notified of activation. Got six months or so full pay. My dreams lead me to the 1895G.

I was looking for one in 450 Marlin, but my dealer said "Hey I got one in 45-70 that someone just brought it. Bought it from me last year, but can't stand the recoil. I asked how much and he said $350. I said sold. It was hardly used. Took it home with one box of ammo. Got a deer with it the next week. Boy did it smack me upside the cheek. I learned to load for it with mostly 300 grain bullets. Lead and jacketed. Added a shotgun 4x scope to the top. Accuracy varies by load of course, but I noted this rifle shoots to point of aim, adjustments for ammo types are for elevation only, never for left/right. The shotgun scope although a cheap one, has handled the recoil just fine.

I load mostly with AA5744 (is there anything you can't load with it) and also Unique. I did load with some with AA3100 and IMR4895. Also Trail Boss. I guy at a Gun Club gave me his Unique Loading. Just a little tiny bit of powder in that great big case. I used toilet paper for wadding to hold things down at the bottom of the case. Those light loads shoot well. I used Hornady Factory loads for Hunting due to the extra range, but the reality is most shots are under 50 yards in the dense hardwood forests of central NY. My friend with the 7 MM mag calls my 45-70 a hand cannon, but 7 MM Mag is certainly overkill for white tails. My other 45-70 is my Trap Door. I shoot it with light loads.
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Old 10-17-2020, 09:44   #20
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The wood on my 1895CB was nearly Sap Wood it was super light and very porous. That stock has 15 coats of Tru Oil on it! The gun weighed 7 lbs on the nose and my 1894 weighed 7 lbs 6 oz? So "wood density" was not happening.

It finished up nice but I had to work at it.

The gun shoots really well and I shot a 1 3/4" 5 shot 100 yard group with my standard load with Iron Sights.

You do real well with Cera Kote!

Randy
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