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So...this is the only Mini-14 she wants to ban?


I find it interesting that she's talking about discriminating against "ugly" or "tactical" or "dangerous" or "intimidating", but mostly BLACK rifles. Nothing wrong with my All Weather Ranch Rifle, right? Or, for that matter, a Tactical in a factory synthetic stock?
 

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According to my interpretation of this link on CNN, here is where Feinstein's proposal bans the Tactical model in a conventional stock.

Summary of bill > What's in Feinstein's gun bill - CNN.com

"All semiautomatic rifles that can accept a detachable magazine and have at least one military feature: pistol grip; forward grip; folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; grenade launcher or rocket launcher; barrel shroud; or threaded barrel."
 

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According to my interpretation of this link on CNN, here is where Feinstein's proposal bans the Tactical model in a conventional stock.

Summary of bill > What's in Feinstein's gun bill - CNN.com

"All semiautomatic rifles that can accept a detachable magazine and have at least one military feature: pistol grip; forward grip; folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; grenade launcher or rocket launcher; barrel shroud; or threaded barrel."
Ah, yes. I'd forgotten about the "military feature" language...:angry:
 

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So...this is the only Mini-14 she wants to ban?


I find it interesting that she's talking about discriminating against "ugly" or "tactical" or "dangerous" or "intimidating", but mostly BLACK rifles. Nothing wrong with my All Weather Ranch Rifle, right? Or, for that matter, a Tactical in a factory synthetic stock?
Hi COBrien;

It was interesting to me to see that the name listed in the Ruger catalog is the banned item. Thing is, that this is just a different configuration of the same rifle, with no way of telling it apart from the others, aside from the stock. This leads to some questions (assuming the Intolerable Act passes)
1. If you own the evil "Ruger Mini-14 Tactical Rife M-14/20CF" and put a conventional all-weather stock on it, is it still prohibited? To the best of my knowledge there's no receiver marking that differentiates it from the other tactical rifles. Will silver soldering the flash hider in place be "good enough" to make it "unbanned"?
2. Will the owner of a M1A have to have the castle nut permanently welded in place to keep it legal (threaded bbl)? What about a Garand? Will the gas nut lock have to be permanently attached, even though it is not there to support a sound suppressor or flash hider?
3. To the best of my knowledge, courts have held that the original language banning "all AR type rifles" is too vague, so only the exact listed name is acceptable. What if you have an "off list" AR or AK? How close to the exact name must it be? Any Calguns people with first hand experience on their AW list out there?
4. What exactly constitutes an "AR type rifle"? If I design a new lower with a conventional stock that accepts AR upper assemblies is that good, bad, or merely ugly? Is any rifle that accepts an AR upper an AR?
5. What if I remove the gas tube or the gas piston from an AR or AK? Is it still semi-auto?
6. It says that transfers have to go through NFA, but I didn't see anything that says that original owners have to register. Did I miss something?
7. If I hand an AK to a buddy at the range, have I just illegally transferred a weapon or magazine, since he didn't possess them before the ban took effect?
8. Can I mail a firearm in for repair? Can I mail magazines to myself (done that kind of thing when moving before)? Can I mail a firearm to myself if its "evil"?
9. All mags will have to be inscribed with a serial number, presumably so that the DOD can keep track of them all. This really is going to get some of our people killed in war zones when they go to recover mags they should just leave behind. What if you need to share out mags? There was trading of magazines to allied units during the first gulf war (UK mags didn't work well in SA80 so they would trade for 'em to get one mag they could count on).
10. What if you have magazines backordered and they show up after the ban takes effect? Have you committed a crime by accepting it, or did you "possess" it when you paid for it? What about a firearm on order from a distributor - can you accept it after the ban or are you SOL?

This bill is just plain one badly written POS.

Frankly, reading through it, this strikes me as being more than just a "gun grab" or a wrongheaded attempt at crime control. This is "political payback" for opposing the progressives in the past, since there is a lot of effort expended to make it nakedly punitive.

All the best,
Grumpy
 

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According to my interpretation of this link on CNN, here is where Feinstein's proposal bans the Tactical model in a conventional stock.

Summary of bill > What's in Feinstein's gun bill - CNN.com

"All semiautomatic rifles that can accept a detachable magazine and have at least one military feature: pistol grip; forward grip; folding, telescoping, or detachable stock; grenade launcher or rocket launcher; barrel shroud; or threaded barrel."
Well good thing they're trying to address those silly grenade and rocket launchers... Those kids are running around rampant with them.
 

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It also says all weapons lawfully posessed at the time of enactment will be grandfathered - same for magazines.
Not all "grandfather clauses" are created equal.
1. Mags cannot be resold, passed down, etc. This represents theft of my family's property, as well as theft of my use of my own property. If I have medical expenses, etc and need to sell some guns and accessories to pay for it, this is illegal. The government has stolen the use of my lawfully purchased and lawfully held property.
2. Do the weapons need to be entered into the National Firearms Registry of the NFA? If so, that's a $200 tax per gun. Collectors with large collections can count on paying some thousands of dollars at minimum.
3. If NFA is req'd to merely continue to possess your weapons, this means that you have to ask the local police "pretty please" to keep your guns. They can decline and you are now a person known to the cops to be in possession of "illegal guns".
4. That inability to sell/buy magazines cuts both ways. What if you have always dreamed of a Thompson semi auto carbine but it was just a little out of reach? Fortune smiles upon you and - you can't buy magazines anymore. Those of us who collect will be hit really hard here. How many mags for collectible guns you don't have yet do you keep on hand? Any? How many PPSh41 mags do you have? PPS43? Thompson drums? M1 Carbine mags? Mauser 98 trench mags (25 shots for the M98)? AK mags? G3 mags? Valmet mags? AUG mags? FAMAS mags? AR "waffle" mags for that early '60's retro build? BM59 mags? Browning Hi Power mags? Sten mags? Sterling mags? Greasegun mags? Uzi mags? etc.

Perhaps most importantly of all, NONE of the legislation being discussed would do a single thing to prevent atrocities like the one at Sandy Hook. The perp did not buy a gun, did not use an "assault weapon" (Connecticut already has an assault weapon ban for pete's sake!), and would not in any way have been inconvenienced by having to pause for 2 seconds after every 10 trapped victims had been slain! This bill is payback, pure and simple. Payback for not being a good little sheeple, payback for liking guns, payback for not being "enlightened" like the welfare sponges and limosine liberals of SF. This is payback for being a middle class conservative gunowner - the kind of person "enlightened" progressives genuinely love to hate.

Respectfully,
Grumpy
 

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So no matter what "EVIL" or "MILITARY" items I have its banned. But if I change to a composite factory stock and have the EXACT SAME GUN with the exact features and capability it wont be. Hmmm seems logical....:mad::mad::mad:
 

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It also says all weapons lawfully posessed at the time of enactment will be grandfathered - same for magazines.
The original summary of the Bill required grandfathered weapons to be registered under the NFA (as suppressors are now). This would equate to national registration and, most likely, a tax stamp.

The "good" news is that NFA isn't mentioned in today's version of the summary, so it's either been removed from the Bill or buried from sight.
 

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Not all "grandfather clauses" are created equal.
1. Mags cannot be resold, passed down, etc. This represents theft of my family's property, as well as theft of my use of my own property. If I have medical expenses, etc and need to sell some guns and accessories to pay for it, this is illegal. The government has stolen the use of my lawfully purchased and lawfully held property.
2. Do the weapons need to be entered into the National Firearms Registry of the NFA? If so, that's a $200 tax per gun. Collectors with large collections can count on paying some thousands of dollars at minimum.
3. If NFA is req'd to merely continue to possess your weapons, this means that you have to ask the local police "pretty please" to keep your guns. They can decline and you are now a person known to the cops to be in possession of "illegal guns".
4. That inability to sell/buy magazines cuts both ways. What if you have always dreamed of a Thompson semi auto carbine but it was just a little out of reach? Fortune smiles upon you and - you can't buy magazines anymore. Those of us who collect will be hit really hard here. How many mags for collectible guns you don't have yet do you keep on hand? Any? How many PPSh41 mags do you have? PPS43? Thompson drums? M1 Carbine mags? Mauser 98 trench mags (25 shots for the M98)? AK mags? G3 mags? Valmet mags? AUG mags? FAMAS mags? AR "waffle" mags for that early '60's retro build? BM59 mags? Browning Hi Power mags? Sten mags? Sterling mags? Greasegun mags? Uzi mags? etc.

Perhaps most importantly of all, NONE of the legislation being discussed would do a single thing to prevent atrocities like the one at Sandy Hook. The perp did not buy a gun, did not use an "assault weapon" (Connecticut already has an assault weapon ban for pete's sake!), and would not in any way have been inconvenienced by having to pause for 2 seconds after every 10 trapped victims had been slain! This bill is payback, pure and simple. Payback for not being a good little sheeple, payback for liking guns, payback for not being "enlightened" like the welfare sponges and limosine liberals of SF. This is payback for being a middle class conservative gunowner - the kind of person "enlightened" progressives genuinely love to hate.

Respectfully,
Grumpy
Grumpy.. take a deep breath.. you had me at the Calguns comment.

btw did it mention a grandfathering of bulletbuttons? cuz if we ban the bulletbutton federally CA is screwed! Does this retroactively make our toys CA assault weapons?
 

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Grumpy.. take a deep breath.. you had me at the Calguns comment.

btw did it mention a grandfathering of bulletbuttons? cuz if we ban the bulletbutton federally CA is screwed! Does this retroactively make our toys CA assault weapons?
Sorry whofarted, sometimes I get a little carried away! :rolleyes:

Yep, the gunnies in California are righteously screwed if they ban the "bullet button".

The whole POS bill needs to go in the sewer where it belongs. This thing is a multi-flush piece of legislation.

All the best,
Grumpy
 

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Good news...

according to the attached PDF

the H and K SP89 pistol would still be legal...

don't know what a Heckler and Kock SP89 is

Freudian slip maybe? :lol:

oh wait here it is... the heckler and Kock SP89:
 

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Sorry whofarted, sometimes I get a little carried away! :rolleyes:

Yep, the gunnies in California are righteously screwed if they ban the "bullet button".

The whole POS bill needs to go in the sewer where it belongs. This thing is a multi-flush piece of legislation.

All the best,
Grumpy
DiFi's bill is the least of our sh¡t right now. We also have an amended awb, an ammo restriction bill and an ammo permit bill all in the works right now
CA Legislative Info
 

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This is disarmerment!!
They have something coming and they want to midigate their loses this way.
AND..
If my state does not allow NFA and that is part of a passed law, what happens to us?
 

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DiFi's bill is the least of our sh¡t right now. We also have an amended awb, an ammo restriction bill and an ammo permit bill all in the works right now
CA Legislative Info
Hi whofarted;

Damn' that's some nasty stuff that's rolling downhill in CA. I usually keep a closer eye on Calguns, but have been focused on the federal thing lately. Thanks for the heads up. Looks like they're going to try to use the list of RAW to go after those next, as well as hose the mag replacement parts kits and 10/30 mags. And the ammo limits thing shows they're going after active recreational/competition shooters. In some ways the "ammo permit" thing is a backdoor way of implementing a FOID system like we used to have in Illinois. Guess it shouldn't surprise me, given the authors, and given the strong antigun mood in the urban strongholds.

It really does feel like they're trying to take the fun out of the shooting sports to punish us when I read garbage like that....

Hang in there,
Grumpy
 
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I am not an expert, but I do know a few things about legislation negotiations. My impression; the bill is a wish list. The "holy grail" so to speak. Lots of stuff gets put into these bills and then is used as something to barin away as a concession. Its just like figuring out the price you will take on an item your selling than tacking on little extra so when someone shows interest or makes an offer you can bring the price down a little so it seems like your giving in a little. My dear departed, flea market entrepreneur, mother called this "wiggle room."

I am going to go out on a limb here, (knock on wood, cross my fingers etc.) that a lot of this language will get toned down with negotiations.

Some of my optimism is based partly on the fact that M. McConnell just got H. Reid to cave on filibuster reform. Reid is on the record at least a dozen times in the past year talking about changing the 60 vote min. to stop a filibuster and he's caved less than 7 days into Obama's 2nd term.
 
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