[E.D. Montechizuma]

Will putting this

or this

onto the bottom rail of my M1A SOCOM II constitute it as an "Assault Weapon" Under California law? dose it count as a "froward pistol grip"

 

[uncle jerky]

Will putting this

or this

onto the bottom rail of my M1A SOCOM II constitute it as an "Assault Weapon" Under California law? dose it count as a "froward pistol grip"

After consulting with AHHnold. No one knows:huh:

 

[NotSoFast]

Check on the calguns.net forum, http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/index.php , for info on that. While I'm from CA, not being interested in that type of weapon, I don't know the ins and outs for that part of the law, whereas there are a lot there who do and will be more than happy to fill you in.

Chuck

 

[rowdy1]

A forward pistol grip or any other/all "evil" features are ok as long as the weapon has a fixed mag holding 10 shots or less.

sam

 

[7.62Cavalier]

Yes putting one of those on a socom would make it a SB23 "evil feature" and make it an assault weapon. As has been said already check out
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/index.php For good CA firearm info.

 

[AR15_Fanatic]

Im sorry to say, but the answer is yes, a forward grip would make it an assault weapon by California law.

From the horse's mouth
http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/dwcl/12275.php

12276.1. (a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:

(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.

(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.

(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.

(4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning his or her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.

(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.

(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
(A) A folding or telescoping stock.
(B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.

(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.

(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
(b) The Legislature finds a significant public purpose in exempting pistols that are designed expressly for use in Olympic target shooting events. Therefore, those pistols that are sanctioned by the International Olympic Committee and by USA Shooting, the national governing body for international shooting competition in the United States, and that are used for Olympic target shooting purposes at the time the act adding this subdivision is enacted, and that would otherwise fall within the definition of "assault weapon" pursuant to this section are exempt, as provided in subdivision (c).
(c) "Assault weapon" does not include either of the following: (1) Any antique firearm.
(2) Any of the following pistols, because they are consistent with the significant public purpose expressed in subdivision (b):
MANUFACTURER MODEL CALIBER BENELLI MP90 .22LR BENELLI MP90 .32 S&W LONG BENELLI MP95 .22LR BENELLI MP95 .32 S&W LONG HAMMERLI 280 .22LR HAMMERLI 280 .32 S&W LONG HAMMERLI SP20 .22LR HAMMERLI SP20 .32 S&W LONG PARDINI GPO .22 SHORT PARDINI GP-SCHUMANN .22 SHORT PARDINI HP .32 S&W LONG PARDINI MP .32 S&W LONG PARDINI SP .22LR PARDINI SPE .22LR WALTHER GSP .22LR WALTHER GSP .32 S&W LONG WALTHER OSP .22 SHORT WALTHER OSP-2000 .22 SHORT
(3) The Department of Justice shall create a program that is consistent with the purposes stated in subdivision
(b) to exempt new models of competitive pistols that would otherwise fall within the definition of "assault weapon" pursuant to this section from being classified as an assault weapon. The exempt competitive pistols may be based on recommendations by USA Shooting consistent with the regulations contained in the USA Shooting Official Rules or may be based on the recommendation or rules of any other organization that the department deems relevant.
(d) The following definitions shall apply under this section:
(1) "Magazine" shall mean any ammunition feeding device.
(2) "Capacity to accept more than 10 rounds" shall mean capable of accommodating more than 10 rounds, but shall not be construed to include a feeding device that has been permanently altered so that it cannot accommodate more than 10 rounds.
(3) "Antique firearm" means any firearm manufactured prior to January 1, 1899.

(e) This section shall become operative January 1, 2000.

 

[torquemada055]

http://calguns.net/a_california_arak.htm
http://www.calguns.net/copmemo2.pdf

 

[takezo]

DON'T DO IT!!! DON'T DO IT!! Illegal in the PRK.

 

[stickfighter]

Mini?

Why can you buy a Mini 14 here in Ventura county? It has a detachable mag. By the way, look at what people shoot at the range. Cops don't care what you have until you use it in a fire fight.

 

[AR15_Fanatic]

Why can you buy a Mini 14 here in Ventura county? It has a detachable mag. By the way, look at what people shoot at the range. Cops don't care what you have until you use it in a fire fight.

Read the law.

12276.1. (a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:

(A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
(B) A thumbhole stock.
(C) A folding or telescoping stock.
(D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
(E) A flash suppressor.
(F) A forward pistol grip.

(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.

(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.

Therefore a Mini-14 does not qualify as an assault weapon in the state of California.

 

[fcoy2]

Thumbhole?

Can anyone explain to me the reasoning given for prohibiting a firearm with a "thumbhole stock"?

 

[AR15_Fanatic]

Can anyone explain to me the reasoning given for prohibiting a firearm with a "thumbhole stock"?

The same reason that you can't have a flash suppressor on the rifle. Just because.

 

[COBRADOC]

The same reason that you can't have a flash suppressor on the rifle. Just because.

Not that this effects me in Florida (yet), but what if the device on the end of the barrel is called and sold as a "muzzle break"? Just curious.

 

[AR15_Fanatic]

Not that this effects me in Florida (yet), but what if the device on the end of the barrel is called and sold as a "muzzle break"? Just curious.

You'll have to check with the laws of that juristiction on 'assault weapons'. There may be a provision, saying something of the order

"A flash suppressor shall be any kind of device fitted to the muzzle of the weapon for the specific purpose of degrading or eliminating muzzle flash when the weapon is fired."

Just a guess

I believe the original reason for this provision was to ban threaded barrels that can accomodate silencers, etc.

 

[spazz45]

So California residents can only have 10 round magazines for a mini 14. Unless a larger mag has been perminately fixed to accept only 10 rounds?

 

[Suvorov]

So California residents can only have 10 round magazines for a mini 14. Unless a larger mag has been perminately fixed to accept only 10 rounds?

NO. A large capacity magazine CAN NOT be permanently attached to a rifle or it will make it an assault weapon. Fixed magazine builds must have a magazine capacity of 10 rounds or less.

Large capacity magazines CAN be used in "featureless" rifles such as a stock Mini-14 or an ARtype with a Monsterman Grip. The problem here is that it is illegal to import high capacity magazines or to sell/trade them in California unless you owned them in the state prior to Y2K.

If you have some large capacity Mini magazines that you had here prior to Y2K, then shoot them with your stock mini to your hearts content. If not, then you are stuck with 10 rounders.

 

[Suvorov]

Can anyone explain to me the reasoning given for prohibiting a firearm with a "thumbhole stock"?

Because the commissars in Sacramento saw how the 1994 AWB was circumvented by putting thumbhole stocks on AKtype rifles. They wanted their decry to be more draconian so they included thumbhole stocks.

 

[Handload]

I wonder if there is any type of muzzlebreak, compensator, or similar device mounted on the muzzle of a Mini-14 that wouldn't automatically make it an "assault rifle"?

 

[masterPsmith]

I wonder if there is any type of muzzlebreak, compensator, or similar device mounted on the muzzle of a Mini-14 that wouldn't automatically make it an "assault rifle"?

There are true muzzle brakes on the market for the Mini-14, but they are threaded. Your muzzle would have to be threaded to accept the brake. The brake would then have to be welded in place to make it non-removable, as the threaded muzzle would make it an assault weapon within the definitions of the law in California if the brake was removable.

There is one true pin-on muzzle brake/compensator available for the Mini-14, but is is only available on a limited basis. They are machined one at a time per pre-paid order. It requires slight minor fitting to the front sight and should be checked for bullet exit clearance once installed. These are made to exacting dimensions. I can give more info via a PM or E-Mail.

Here are a few photos: These are not flash suppressors and are Cali Legal..

 

[stchman]

The reason the Mini-14 is not considered an "assault" weapon is because it does not LOOK like an assault weapon.

Yes, they are restricting a firearm on cosmetics, not function.

From a functional standpoint a Mini-14 and an AR-15 are very similar. Bot can accept larger capacity magazines, achieve high rates of fire. Hell, they even fire the same round. The Mini looks like a hunting rifle while the AR looks like a terrorist machine gun. I am not saying this is right, just offering an explanation.

This is one of the reasons I have no desire to move to Commufornia.