[MAD76239]

After cleaning my mini 30 (583) today and wondering the entire time why this rifle will not shoot steel ammo. I think this may be a solution and if anyone has any feedback on whether you think this would work or why it wouldn't work I would appreciate it.

I have noticed that with the tula ammo I have bought, the primers a recessed slightly more than the brass that I have which is Fiocchi. On the tula, it can range from 0.010"-0.015". The Fiocchi is pretty consistent, ranging from 0.008"-0.010" Is the extra 0.005" on the tula enough to make a difference of whether the primer goes off or not? If so then that is a problem that I obviously cannot fix.

After thinking about this, I remembered seeing that the firing pin in my rifle will actually go below flush on the back of my bolt, about 0.010." There is basically 0.010" of free play between when the pin is flush and when it is below flush. It also means that when the pin is below flush, the striker sticks out 0.010" more than it does when it is flush. When the hammer strikes, it only hits the back of the bolt, it does not follow through on the back of the firing pin. In this case, that means that the firing pin is basically going off of momentum for 0.010." Well in my opinion that would make for a "soft strike" especially on the harder primers in the steel ammo. So what I am thinking is that if I even just mill off 0.005" from the back of the bolt, then the hammer will follow through the extra 0.005" that the tula primers are recessed, and even if the ammo is not recessed it will still make a harder strike. Any feedback or opinions are appreciated, just figured i would share my thought. Thanks.

 

[tri70]

There was a thread on this subject and it did greatly improve the ignition on foreign ammo. Taking .005 off is not much for the gain and should not give you any problems.

 

[James T. Kirk]

Well I'm gonna be "that guy" and say... There is no way I could justify milling the bolt just to shoot steel case ammo when brass is only 5 more cent a shots. Then there is the Ruger guarantee, it will be voided if you start cutting the bolt, and if it ever breaks it will be on your dime to fix it. I think you will save money in the long run if you get some brass ammo or start reloading.

 

[MAD76239]

Unfortunately where I live fiocchi brass (the only brass 7.62 I have ever found in new england) is about 50 cents a round and steel is about 25 cents a round, And in my state, I can't have ammo delivered to my door. I would much rather shoot brass through it. How is the firingpins.com pin with steel ammo? Will it work with the 583 series? It is definitely different than the one in my rifle.

 

[chill1955]

Listen to Capt. Kirk

Well I'm gonna be "that guy" and say... There is no way I could justify milling the bolt just to shoot steel case ammo when brass is only 5 more cent a shots. Then there is the Ruger guarantee, it will be voided if you start cutting the bolt, and if it ever breaks it will be on your dime to fix it. I think you will save money in the long run if you get some brass ammo or start reloading.

Pull the pin measure it up, have a local machine shop crank out a pin longer to detonate the harder berdan primer. And if the rounds are sealed in poly what not, the resistance to detonate would be increased. One could also buy another firing pin spring and start knocking of one coil at a time test/ repeat.:blink:
Or you could buy a surplus SKS (cheapest option) and make that your practice rilfe, they eat any steel.

 

[Jeff F]

If you make the pin hit deeper there's also the chance you could start piercing primers, never a good thing.

 

[James T. Kirk]

Unfortunately where I live fiocchi brass (the only brass 7.62 I have ever found in new england) is about 50 cents a round and steel is about 25 cents a round, And in my state, I can't have ammo delivered to my door. I would much rather shoot brass through it. How is the firingpins.com pin with steel ammo? Will it work with the 583 series? It is definitely different than the one in my rifle.

Ah well that sucks. I was gonna tell you to try ammoseek.com. You can some times find deals on reloads for .35 cents a shot.

 

[Coletrain]

I got the firingpins.com firing pin. I just used some 400 and 800 grit sand paper to shorten the protrusion from the front of the bolt. It also has a shallower recess at the back of the bolt. I'll check my notes and post my current firing pin protrusion. I've had good ignition from wolf and tula. I haven't had any pierced primers. I really doubt I will since ak's and sks's have a much longer protrusion and no one tells you to avoid soft primer brass cased ammo in those rifle types.

Just do your homework if you're going to try this. I'll be glad to help someone get started if they're interested.

 

[MAD76239]

Does anyone know if the firingpins.com pin will work in a 583 series rifle? It looks different than mine, and I called the company earlier today but they said they were not sure.

 

[tri70]

Does anyone know if the firingpins.com pin will work in a 583 series rifle? It looks different than mine, and I called the company earlier today but they said they were not sure.

You can see what guarantees come with them, it would help sales if someone tested them out here.

 

[Coletrain]

Mine fit a 582. I don't think much changed in dimensions on the bolts in between. The pins need to specifically fitted to your rifle anyway.

 

[sandog]

Mad76239, grinding off the back of your bolt, ( or installing a heavier hammer spring ), will speed up the moment when your firing pin will break, but that's about it.
Your firing pin has "ledges" on it, that correspond with "shelves" inside the bolt. Your stock pin can only go so far before it stops, hitting the pin harder by means of a heavier hammer spring or grinding off the back of the bolt so that the hammer hits the firing pin with more momentum and velocity, will not make the firing pin miraculously move farther inside the bolt.
What must be done is to fit a longer firing pin. If you don't feel like the trouble of fitting a new pin is worth it to you, don't mess with things at all. It took me all of 10 minutes to fit my aftermarket pin.
The Mini firing pin was designed to be a partial momentum pin. It is supposed to fit inside the bolt at the back, not be protruding. When the hammer hits, it contacts the firing pin briefly, and momentum sends it the rest of the way to the primer.
This system works fine, the hammer is not in contact with the firing pin the whole time.
If you must use cheap ammo, try some Red Army Standard. You'll probably experience 100% ignition without having to grind things on your Mini.

 

[tri70]

Every mini firi pin is a custom fit so taking a slight amount off should not void warranty or give problems with breakage. (.005)

 

[sandog]

Every mini firi pin is a custom fit so taking a slight amount off should not void warranty or give problems with breakage. (.005)

True, but you usually have to have a longer firing pin for this, not a shorter one, so taking off the length wouldn't apply here. And the OP was taking length off his bolt, not his firing pin.

 

[Coletrain]

Here's my raw data:

Factory firing pin:
Overall length: 2.6895"
Pin protrusion: .035"
Rear of bolt recess: .010"

Firingpins.com pin:
Overall length: 2.7245"
Advertised overall length: 2.726"
Original pin protrusion: .061"
Rear of bolt recess: .0045"

I sanded down the tip until the tip protruded .045". I had two light primer strike on Wolf during my first outing with this pin length. It hasn't happed since. It has yet to give a light strike on Tula with the current length. I saved a bunch of casings. If you guys think it relavent I'll photograph primers and post them here.

 

[CPTKILLER]

The Mini 30 was apparently not made or designed for steel cased ammo. As such with the compromises and low cost, it is not an AK. Ruger should have done their homework.

As a result I got a DDI AK74. If a US AK manufacturer can do that, so can Ruger.

 

[Coletrain]

Well, I don't think it's their lack of homework. I think they intentionally made their rifles not work well with steel cased ammo.

 

[MAD76239]

Thanks everyone for the input. I'm just going to try a longer pin. When fitting the longer pin is it just the tip that has to be filed down or does the back section have to be also?

 

[tri70]

You want the back of the firing pin to sit slightly below the back of the bolt. This is a safety feature that only allows the gun to fire when the bolt is completely locked into battery and rotated to the proper firing position.

 

[Coletrain]

You want the back of the firing pin to sit slightly below the back of the bolt. This is a safety feature that only allows the gun to fire when the bolt is completely locked into battery and rotated to the proper firing position.

The safety feature is the "protuberance" on the side of the firing pin. It won't let the pin go forward until the bolt has rotated into battery. Then the "protuberance" is allowed to pass through a recess in the receiver. The rear recess in the firing pin doesn't effect that function. I just lets the firing pin "float" under the hammer. I think it probably just prevents the crystallization that makes firing pins break.