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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I plan to offer such a gun in a few years hence! I have thought of a way for a pair of 5 shooters to offer over 20 hits on a man's chest at 10 ft or so, in less than 1 second, first shot to last, with plenty of penetration/power per hit, too. Given non corrosive caps that can ignite smokeless powder, and Hodgdon's 2400 fps (in a rifle) black powder substitute (TripleSeven) some very interesting possiblilities are present. Like sale thru the mail without any Federal laws being in effect. :)

With today's great tolerance control in manufacturing, having spare cylinders does not have to mean a lack of real accuracy, and the cylinders will swap out on my design in less than 10 seconds, guys. I figure on a 3" barrel, 7.5" OAL, which can be front pants pocket holsterable, if you poke a hole in the bottom of the pocket. Given a state where no permit is required to CCw, like Vermont, Alaska, Arizona, etc, the fact that there's a bulge in your pants pocket is irrelevant. With one of these in each hand, a skilled man will be more than a match for the typical punk with his Glock.
 

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I'd prefer the simplicity of the single action when it comes to dis-assembly and cleaning.
I've owned a few bp revolver reproductions including the walker. I still have the Ruger Old Army. I wish there was a larger caliber revolver that would take the .490 round ball!
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
my design takes down MUCH more simply than the SA cap and ball designs. no swing out cylinder. there is no reason to stick to the horribly corrosive black powder, with a modern design. simply by not having a cartridge, you become exempt from fed laws about firearms.
 

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I plan to offer such a gun in a few years hence! I have thought of a way for a pair of 5 shooters to offer over 20 hits on a man's chest at 10 ft or so, in less than 1 second, first shot to last, with plenty of penetration/power per hit, too. Given non corrosive caps that can ignite smokeless powder, and Hodgdon's 2400 fps (in a rifle) black powder substitute (TripleSeven) some very interesting possiblilities are present. Like sale thru the mail without any Federal laws being in effect. :)

With today's great tolerance control in manufacturing, having spare cylinders does not have to mean a lack of real accuracy, and the cylinders will swap out on my design in less than 10 seconds, guys. I figure on a 3" barrel, 7.5" OAL, which can be front pants pocket holsterable, if you poke a hole in the bottom of the pocket. Given a state where no permit is required to CCw, like Vermont, Alaska, Arizona, etc, the fact that there's a bulge in your pants pocket is irrelevant. With one of these in each hand, a skilled man will be more than a match for the typical punk with his Glock.
Hi whoa, unless your gun closely replicates a historical gun, you may not qualify as a historical gun that is exempt from federal firearm laws. Even with replicas some states like New York require that a replica pistol must be added to a pistol permit if powder and caps (ammo) are readily available.

Frankly, there's already an excellent $200 BP revolver that can group <2" @ 25yds where cylinders can be changed out in less than 10 seconds, the Pietta 1858 Remington. The 1858 can be purchased in either a 8 or 5 1/2" barrel. A hacksaw can easily make the barrel shorter if desired. The 8" barrel Remy can deliver ~1000fps with a round ball and Triple 7. :)

IMO turn an 1858 Remy into your dream gun.

Regards,
Richard
 

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I think it would be neat to see something like that on the market, but I can't say I'd buy one.

My interest in cap and ball guns is more hobby oriented - relatively cheap historical replicas - not for self defense. But I also like oddities, so who knows? I suppose it would depend on a lot on the price.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
PRICE will be a bit steep, if stainless as i plan, probably $550 retail and no dealer discounts, since it can be sold directly in the mail. The fed law states that as long as it's not a cartridge arm, it's exempt from Fed law. USC 920-921. GCA 68 specifically exempts such guns, actually. there's some other confusing type wording, but it doesn't change what I said is the effect. I can get 1000 fps out of 8" with FFF g, so the triple 7 doesnt add anyting to that barrel length. I want DA, and so do many others. 3x as fast repeat hits as can be done thumbing an SA's hammer, one handed, at least.
 

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Why would I purchase a Contraption of dubious quality via the mail from an aging convicted felon who will in all likelyhood rip me off, when I can walk into any Local gun shop and purchase a perfectly good firearm legally?
your dreams will amount to nothing, you, at 60 years old have lived a useless and stupid life, and now so very close to the end of it, you continue to waste what time you have left, trying to make total strangers in the interwebs think you are "something" with your silly rantings So pathetic...


Unlike you, We actually have retained our right to bear arms because we are law abiding citizens... Not Criminal scumbags like you. we don't need some homespun federal exempt zipgun to arm ourselves with. We Have that covered via Big 5 sporting goods thank you very much.


perhaps you should build this wonderful device you speak of,
and then Shoot yourself in the head with it to prove it works. :lol: if you DO decide to Pull a Bud Dwyer, make sure you tape it please.

Keep posting Convict, I'm having a grand time at your expense, silly old man.
 

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Xylob the destroyer, only 23 post and you caught on to who it was. I just turned 52 today, must look like an old fool. TAP, Gunkid or whoever, I should have seen it. :lol: Good post!:)
 

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123.............posts
 

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Why would I purchase a Contraption of dubious quality via the mail from an aging convicted felon who will in all likelyhood rip me off, when I can walk into any Local gun shop and purchase a perfectly good firearm legally?
your dreams will amount to nothing, you, at 60 years old have lived a useless and stupid life, and now so very close to the end of it, you continue to waste what time you have left, trying to make total strangers in the interwebs think you are "something" with your silly rantings So pathetic...

Unlike you, We actually have retained our right to bear arms because we are law abiding citizens... Not Criminal scumbags like you. we don't need some homespun federal exempt zipgun to arm ourselves with. We Have that covered via Big 5 sporting goods thank you very much.

perhaps you should build this wonderful device you speak of,
and then Shoot yourself in the head with it to prove it works. :lol: if you DO decide to Pull a Bud Dwyer, make sure you tape it please.

Keep posting Convict, I'm having a grand time at your expense, silly old man.
Gosh, that was pretty hard on the fellow. Just because he may be a convicted felon, that doesn't mean he isn't a human being deserving of at least being spoken to humanely. For Pete's sake, telling the man to shoot himself in the head and that his life is wasted and useless? Can you imagine the lawsuit against you and this site by his family if he actually killed himself as a result of your suggestion and insults to him here? I'm surprised this inhumane insulting treatment was allowed by a moderator. One other thing to remember, "Carbine Williams" who invented the short stroke piston semi-auto rifle that eventually became the M1 carbine was also a convicted felon too. In fact he actually invented and built a working model while he was in prison! You can see the story of his life in the movie entitled "Carbine Williams" starring Gary Cooper.

Unless the gentleman has done something bad here such as rip off a person at this site, in spite of him being a convicted felon, shouldn't he be treated humanely and at least given the benefit of the doubt? Isn't the whole theory of "rehabilitation" once a person is released from prison that he can once again become a useful member of society? As a former state law enforcement officer for the Florida Dept of corrections, I have seen a lot of convicted felons who never should have been sent to prison and never should have been convicted felons. I have also seen a lot of people who should have gone to prison and been convicted as felons who got off instead because they had more money to spend on attorneys.

At any rate, I believe we should treat each other with mutual respect at this site and not be insulting with telling people their lives are worthless and suggesting that people should shoot themselves in the head when as a convicted felon they have already undoubtedly had more than their share of adversity in their lives. If he hasn't done anything to anyone at this site, then since he has served his debt to society, we should at the very least be polite to the man and it wouldn't hurt us to listen to his design ideas. Again, remember "Carbine Williams". That doesn't mean anyone here has to buy anything from him.

I don't know the individual and I don't know what his felony was. But I do know that part of the problem in this world is people being cruel and not giving each other mutual respect. I feel this way and I'm a former state of Florida law enforcement officer for the division of corrections. I've seen all types, and I know that disrespect and cruelty only creates resentment and reciprocal disrespect and cruelty.

If we can't be nice to someone, at least we should ignore them without insulting them. But for the grace of God, perhaps any one of us could be walking in his shoes. If the government ever decides to confiscate our guns, a great many of us will be convicted felons then, and then we will be walking in his shoes. We have to know more about someone than just that they are a "convicted felon". There are lots of victimless crimes that are felonies.

Guess I've said enough.

.
 

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Bill google Gun Kid, hes a dirtbag and one of the biggest gun forum trolls to ever visit this site and many others. He compleatly ruined a couple gun sites a few years back. Gun kid aka whoa, tap and hes got a few other user names. Hes not hard to spot as his writing style always stays the same. He is not liked or wanted here. Google him up and enjoy the read.
 

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Bill google Gun Kid, hes a dirtbag and one of the biggest gun forum trolls to ever visit this site and many others. He compleatly ruined a couple gun sites a few years back. Gun kid aka whoa, tap and hes got a few other user names. Hes not hard to spot as his writing style always stays the same. He is not liked or wanted here. Google him up and enjoy the read.
Jeff I don't know the individual or what he has done either felonious, or by being disruptive in firearms sites across the net. But I do know he appears to be a pro gunner. And we need all the pro gunners we can get. There are people who may get on our nerves or even anger us at gun sites, but we need to remember the big picture that at the core of things, we are all brothers and sisters of the 2nd amendment. Our animosity needs to be reserved for anti-gunners and all pro gunners need to stick together. Sometimes pro gunners are their own worse enemy and with the petty bickering and fighting that goes on at some online gun sites, I'm sure the anti-gunners are laughing at our lack of solidarity in our ranks. Perhaps the individual in question simply needs and seeks acceptance, or even just to have a goal to live for. Often times people don't realize how depressed a person can get and perhaps his ideas and dreams are all that keep him going. The least we can do for someone in that position is to be kind, polite and perhaps even supportive to them until they do something so overt that it is time to no longer be kind, polite and supportive. I didn't see anything wrong with his post in this thread he started and only because of his past was he vilified. Perhaps if he was given a chance without being demonized and insulted before he did anything wrong or disruptive, maybe he wouldn't do anything wrong or disruptive. But I'm sure now we won't know because he likely won't come back to this thread now. Anyway, enough of my thoughts on that.

As to the original poster's design ideas. Nice ideas but has already been done. The original poster (OP) when he was talking about 10 shots coming from a five shot black powder revolver, HAD to be thinking of superimposed ball loads. I.E. two balls separated by a felt wad (so the lead balls won't stick to each other due to compression in the barrel) over a charge of powder. That's the only way he could get ten hits out of a five shot cylinder. That's already been done and I sometimes do those loads myself with my black powder revolvers. So nothing new there.

As to it being done using smokeless powder, that has already been done too. There is a company that converts black powder revolvers to use smokeless powder for British shooters who are strangled by anti-gun laws so they need to use cap and ball revolvers for target shooting. These conversions utilize a non corrosive shotgun primer and a smokeless powder, but they are still cap and ball operated revolvers that use loose powder and loose caps to operate. So that has already been done by Westlake Engineering. Read about their Remington Army based Cal. 38 Nitro Conversion that uses shotgun primers for percussion caps and smokeless powder but is still a cap and ball revolver, at this link.....
westlakeengineering.com

And if someone had a cap and ball double action Adams or Tranter revolver that they sent to Westlake Engineering for conversion, then that would amount to exactly the same double action capability the OP had described. I know there are some modern steel versions of double action cap and ball revolvers being produced today, and with the Westlake Engineering conversion to smokeless, they would be exactly what the OP had described. Although usually Westlake Engineering reduces the caliber (and replaces the barrel and cylinder) and reduces the smokeless load as well to a lesser volume so the pressures are safe.

So his ideas had merit, but it is already being done. All someone would have to do is load a double ball load into one of those Westlake Engineering cylinders and barrels installed on a double action cap and ball revolver and they too would throw ten shots from a five cylinder revolver and be exactly what the OP described.

Would there be much of a market for it here in the U.S.? A very small niche market at best. But more of a market for it in England and perhaps Australia, but again, it is already being done by Westlake Engineering. Still not bad thinking and ideas on the part of the OP.

.
 

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No. You do not need a felon who advocates murder as a tactic for survival.
You do not want an ally who abandons family members such as children.

The very last thing you want is John Melvin Davis offering you a business opportunity in a firearms business. Unless you want to join him in PMITA prison.

He showed up on the ZS forums a few years back.
 
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