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Actually the 22PPC and 6mm PPC are bassed off of the 7.92x33 KURZ. Matter of a fact, the 7.62x39 is based off the 7.92x33 KURZ round also.

About the mini forum, they want to shoot under 1 MOA.

Lets take a look at Iraq and Afgan. Our soldiers are taking out targets at range and the enemy is having a hard time hitting our troops with the 7.62x39.
There are reasons that our forces are taking out targets at range whilst the enemy is not, according to you. In Iraq this is somewhat valid, but the difference is training, sheer numerical superiority, and the actual mission of the two opposing forces.

In Afghanistan, those same criteria apply, however it is apparent that our M4 is NOT up to the task of hitting distant targets. Snipers are doing well with various calibers, but regular infantry are not well-equipped for mountain warfare that involves distant targets. The Taliban equipped with old bolt guns is better equipped in that regard, and as a guerilla force, is not trying to over-run our positions. They only shoot when they need to, so there is no way to make a comparison like the one you attempt to make.
 

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I just want to point out that you can get mini 14 mags for 20-25 bucks a piece. Also, why would you unload every night? Do you mean removing the mag(still why) or unloading the mag? Keeping a spring compressed doesn't degrade it's servicability. Loading/unloading is what kills springs.

I'll take a mini over an sks any day. Mine gets 2moa with cheap surplus and has only a few mods, tritium front sight, choate handguard, no accuracy mods.

That being said I'd like to get an sks as a cheap beater that I can get spare parts for. And if you can get one that shoots under 4 moa there is nothing wrong with the weapon for defending your home.

Btw, the bayonet sweetens the pot :) but I'm just stupid grunt who likes destroying hay bails.
 

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Have both SKS and Mini. I like them both. For what I paid for the Mini used I could have bought an SKS and 2500 rds. For what my SAR 8 rig is worth, I could get a crate of SKSs or 3 Minis. If you're buck$ down, get an SKS. PAX
 

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I just want to point out that you can get mini 14 mags for 20-25 bucks a piece. Also, why would you unload every night? Do you mean removing the mag(still why) or unloading the mag? Keeping a spring compressed doesn't degrade it's servicability. Loading/unloading is what kills springs.

I'll take a mini over an sks any day. Mine gets 2moa with cheap surplus and has only a few mods, tritium front sight, choate handguard, no accuracy mods.

That being said I'd like to get an sks as a cheap beater that I can get spare parts for. And if you can get one that shoots under 4 moa there is nothing wrong with the weapon for defending your home.

Btw, the bayonet sweetens the pot :) but I'm just stupid grunt who likes destroying hay bails.
Ok, but put a set of tech sights on that cheap SKS and your group size will definitely improve, 2 moa is quite possible. Leaving springs compressed WILL degrade the springs, it just takes longer than repetitive motion does.
 

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My 580 series mini-14 has an accustrut, trigger job, retorqued gas block, 1911 style recoil buffers, and a tapco stock. My best group with handloads was 1.1''. There is no more shot stringing when the barrel heats up. Very inexpensive mods and she's an moa shooter. I bought 4 20rd. mags a couple months back for $23 apiece. Given the reliability, accuracy, and overall ease in function I would go with a mini-14 all day long. Not to say the sks isnt a good rifle cause it is. The mini is just better.
 

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My 580 series mini-14 has an accustrut, trigger job, retorqued gas block, 1911 style recoil buffers, and a tapco stock. My best group with handloads was 1.1''. There is no more shot stringing when the barrel heats up. Very inexpensive mods and she's an moa shooter. I bought 4 20rd. mags a couple months back for $23 apiece. Given the reliability, accuracy, and overall ease in function I would go with a mini-14 all day long. Not to say the sks isnt a good rifle cause it is. The mini is just better.
I don't dislike the mini series, I have a mini 30 myself. That said, the mini was never designed as an actual combat weapon, it's design is based on a combat weapon, but that is not the same thing. The sks was by design a combat weapon.

The sks, depending on the country of manufacture and the exact model (screw or pinned barrel, etc), can be a fairly accurate to a very accurate weapon. In all cases it will outshoot an ak. The only "mods" really called for on an sks are the bolt mod to facilitate mag changes, and a better sight system to improve accuracy potential. If you do go to detachable mags, you are going to need to "legalize" you sks, for a chicom a tapco stock and mags is enough to do that. Tapco mags are usually under 20 dollars. As long as you stay away from yugo models, you get a chromed bore as well.

For the price of a modded mini 14 one can buy a chicom sks and a couple thousand rounds of steel case ammo....and the sks will eat up that ammo. To me that makes an sks better. I can also use the lower price of an sks to justify the higher price of an AR for a 5.56 weapon. If I want to have both major military small arms calibers represented in my gun safe I prefer an sks and an AR to having a mini 14 and a mini 30. The mini's are nice guns, the sks, ak, and AR are nice weapons. I would never turn down an ak either.
 

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For the price of a modded mini 14 one can buy a chicom sks and a couple thousand rounds of steel case ammo....and the sks will eat up that ammo.
When you compare the Ruger Mini-30 to the SKS, I believe you have a more realistic "apples to apples" comparison, due to both rifles using the 7.62x39 cartridge.

Without question, the Mini-30 is a good rifle, and it will serve many shooters for their individual shooting needs. However, the exact same thing can be said of the SKS rifle.

Between these two rifles, accuracy will depend on several things:
  • The ammo used (presumably brass-cased handloads will shoot better than steel-cased Russian ammo).
  • The condition of the firearm.
  • The sighting system being used.
  • Trigger pull.

As far as a comparison between the two...

The Mini-30 is going to cost you about $800+, the rifle (and Ruger) will prefer you feed it brass-cased ammo, and it will most likely be a 3-4 MOA rifle from the factory.

As far as the positive aspects of the Mini-30, it is going to have a better trigger pull, there are many upgrade and/or stock options available, it is easy to mount a scope to, high capacity magazines are available, and it utilizes the Garand-action.

An SKS rifle is going to cost you about $250+, it will eat ANY 7.62x39 ammo you feed it, and will most likely be a 4-6 MOA rifle. (Yes, some will shoot better. But, I'm talking in general terms here.)

As far as the positive aspects of the SKS rifle, it has a milled action, the barrel is chrome-lined (except for the Yugo's), there are an increasing number of after-market upgrades and/or stock options available, they're very easy to break-down, clean and maintain, and they retain their "collector's value" over time.

As far as price goes, reverendg makes a very good point...you can buy a Chi-com SKS for about $250-$300 and quite a bit of Russian ammo for the price you'll pay for a "modded" Mini-30.

Again, the Mini-30 is a good rifle. And, the SKS rifle is a great option to consider too! ;)
 

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I dont shoot steel cased ammo in anything, and never will. I dont have a problem with sks rifles. I have owned a couple of them and they were accurate. I just think the mini is a better rifle. I have run my mini just as hard as any gun I have ever owned. I know for a fact I can depend on it. There is a reason sks's only cost $100 and the mini $600. Actually, the first sks I ever bought cost me $75. The only reason they are higher now is becouse the supply is running out. My opinion is you get what you pay for. I will say it again. I dont have a problem with any sks. I like them. I just dont think its a better rifle than a mini.
 

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4-6 moa with an SKS sure isn't trying. AK's can shoot that well, better when you replace the trigger with a 30 dollar tapco unit. The SKS is more accurate than an AK any day. And they are shooting cheapo ammo. The reason SKS are cheap is that they are milsurps...and designed to be in real life battles. They have actually been carried on battlefields. Many militaries still use then for ceremonial purposes since they look nicer than an ak in that regard. The mini 14/30 have a garand style action but they aren't garands. If you are comfortable using a mini when the chips are down, go for it. I don't think any of the branches of our military made any field publications related to it though.....
 

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beardenbc: Thanks for the link to his "420 yards" videos.
He also makes excellent shots with his iron-sight German Mauser at about 800-900 yards.

You might have seen nice videos by "Hickok45"?
Being almost computer illiterate, is it a complex process to create a link to a Youtube video?

As for my SKS or Mini 30, if the ammo is fairly cheap and the floating target is destroyed from 100' and sinks, that's good enough.
 

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sks vs mini

I've seen a few minis that were great shooters as is no mods. both 14's and 30's. quite ammo sensitive it seems.
sks will digest any ammo it seems. mini30 pukes on the cheap stuff.
an sks can be made to be a shooter it seems as can minis. the mini trigger (as bad as it is) is better than the sks.
some years back I had a choice of 2 sks's for part payment on some welding work I'd done on an out-of-work house painter's ladder trailer (when the real estate mkt busted) he had 2 sks's a Norinco that while mechanically ok was beat around a bit. (later I wished I'd bought the other one he had for myself and took this one to sell to my nephew) the other an early chinese made in the russki plant which looked good and bright bore - I took it.
sold it to a nephew just getting into guns/shtf realization. he stripped it down useing an online guide (sksboards maybe?) and I got the trigger group here and worked it over according to an online guide (same board IIRC) and got a decent trigger out of it just some creep but when took up a good let-off. w/my guidance he tightened everything in sequence when reassemble after a crown and bore polish. fitted a 4X scope (NC Star I think) useing the reciever cover mount - not the best but we took pains w/it and used locktite and it came out OK.
lo and behold - at the range after we (I mostly) fired a couple 100 through it getting zeroed @100 it began to print silver bear fairly well. a good bore cleaning later we switched to some Sako and man that thing knocks on M.O.A. off our crude rests on the bench. I actually got 3 shots near atop each other then blew the group w/2 called flyers. we ran out of time after takeing a break to print my 30 and his 336 awhile.
I'm fairly sure it would do M.O.A. with good rests and ammo. that means with a 200yd sight in a man @300 is in deep kim-shuueey. that's as good as my hand-tweaked M30 so I ain't gonna be negative of the good sks's. have seen some that flung the cheap wolf blackbox at pie plate groups though. same as the early M30's.
C.E. Harris of American Rifleman fame also did noteably with the same model of SKS - he wrote about it years back. my nephew's sks would do good service as a 'designated marksman' rifle if called upon to do so in shtf situ.
he opted for a Marlin 336 30-30 that I worked over some and 3X9 Burris that shoots M.O.A. w/my good handloads so now that's his go-to after his AK 'bullet hose' he seems to prefer, but his sks is ready as a 'loaner' for kith and kin if/when it's needed.
a '03 Springfield or Finnish X54 it ain't but nonetheless a good shooter in South-Eastern woodland bush, he got a dozen or so strippers for it ready to go.
 

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own both an norc SKS and a mini 30. Norc is a little more comfortable to shoot, but other than that, they both perform the same. Same accuracy (3-4 inches offhand at 100 yards), both wearing tapco stocks. The real difference is the price of the SKS and the trade offs you make for a lower price. My mini has a truly detachable magazine, my SKS does not. My mini came in stainless which I prefer my SKS does not. My mini has a much nicer trigger and no problems with slam fires or the hammer following down, doubling, etc., which can be quite common on the SKS. My mini cost me $700, my SKS cost me $100. Now that you can't seem to touch an SKS for under $400 here in CT and the SKS-D and others designed to use the AK mag are approaching AR-15 prices here in CT ($900-$1500), I don't see much advantage in buying further SKS rifles. For the money the advantages of the Mini seem to outweigh the meager savings in buying an SKS, if there are any savings. Now if the SKS ever drops below $200 again, I'd probably buy 10 of them. But right now they are just to expensive to put up with the trade offs, in my opinion.
Gotta agree with you Louie. The sks is not the bargain it once was. I have a couple of each (SKS & Mini) If i had to bug out I would grab the stainless ranch rifle. The 2 to 3 lb. weight advantage of the mini is significant, as is being stainless and commonality of the 5.56 nato ammo. Get a few spare op-rod springs, and a new bolt assy. from ruger and your all set. That and the fully detach mags and the flatter shooting ammo tips my choice to the mini.

That said, an sks is an ideal knockabout truck gun or close-in home defense and cheap high power plinking rifle.
 

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Erin go Braugh
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I like and enjoy both I just wish the SKS and the Mini 30 had cheaper better mags. The SKS prices are stupid now and the mini's are not any better. I know that Ruger will take care of their stuff and $400ish for a SKS now is ridiculous, but thats what happens the things go to SHTF!
 

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actually, in the era of the $599 AR ( Palmetto State Armory 16" M4A1 Carbine ), I really don't think there is any reason to own an SKS or a mini. Now that I own all three, I can tell you I will be getting rid of both the SKS and Mini to buy more ARs. No reason to own anything else. The AR is just an all around better gun.
 

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I dislike the .223 cartridge which is only a middling varmint round, preferring the 7.62X39 cartridge which I consider to be superior for most purposes.

I'm not a huge fan of the SKS but don't think the sun rises and sets in the AR 15 either.

I like the M1 and M1A much better than either of the above.

I really do like the notion of the 7.62X39 for some reason and the SKS is dead reliable, if short stocked for my 6'3" frame and 36-inch sleeves.

I've got all the above rifles and have had them for many years.
 

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This is an old thread, but I figured I'd chime in with some real thoughts this time after having owned a mini-14 for two years and multiple SKS's for one. I'll compare the mini to my current favorite SKS, a romanian with tech sights.

Price:
My mini 14 set up was about $1,100 by the time all was said and done. My SKS was $375 plus the tech sights, it comes to maybe $425, and for $20 you can get more stripper clips than you'll ever need. SKS wins.

Reliability:
SKS shoots all brands of ammo, never ever ever ever fails. The internal mag might seem archaic to the tacticool crowd, but it has a prone friendly profile, reloads fast with strippers, and never fails. The mini-14 was picky on ammo, and my super expensive pre-ban mags would have failures about 1 out of every 60 rounds. SKS wins.

Hand to hand:
The mini was a solid bat, the SKS is a solid bat with a pike on the end. SKS wins.

Weight:
Since I don't consider the SKS to be heavy by any means (I have man arms), it is sort of like patching a tire that had no hole... But fine, mini-14 wins.

Accuracy:
With wolf, M67 yugo, or Tula, my SKS can shoot 2"-3" groups at 100 yards with regularity, and can even throw down some 1"-2" groups on a good day if I really take it slow. My mini-14 could do about the same, but that was with a 3-9x scope and expensive ammo. Sorry to say it homies, but in my experience, the SKS is more accurate than the mini-14.

Looks:
Both are damn handsome rifles, it's a toss up.

History:
The SKS hung tough with both the M16 and the AK47 in various conflicts. While the mini-14 has not, it has proven to be an effective police carbine in several departments. I personally think the SKS is the winner, but a solid argument can be had for the mini-14.

Handling:
Mini-14 wins this over the front heavy SKS, but like with weight, I feel like the difference is hardly more than nominal.

Care and maintenance:
Both are very easy to maintain, I can't make a call without having done a "fire till dead" test.

Aftermarket:
Original style parts for the SKS are readily available and dirt cheap, and there is a strong market of tacticool gear... But since most of that tapco stuff is garbage, I think I'll have to give this one to the mini-14 on aftermarket goods.

YMMV, but what I learned over the last two years is: My mini-14 was a waste of money I could have spent on more ammo for the SKS.
 

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I don't see the tapco stuff as junk, but otherwise I am pretty much in agreement. The SKS is more rugged than the mini, and handles any cheap ammo you can toss at it without a problem.
 

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I just think tapco could have better thought out their products. My biggest problem is with their magazines, they do not load well from stripper clips, they have a tendency to fall out when they take a hard bump, and their shape makes them very awkward to use like a normal detachable mag. I think tapco would have been better off making an AK mag adapter. The t6 stock does seem to be well liked by those who use it, but to me it felt toyish.

Maybe I'm just being a geezer. I just prefer steel and wood over poly/plastic when it comes down to it.
 

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Erin go Braugh
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AR? This is the SKS page...lol

actually, in the era of the $599 AR ( Palmetto State Armory 16" M4A1 Carbine ), I really don't think there is any reason to own an SKS or a mini. Now that I own all three, I can tell you I will be getting rid of both the SKS and Mini to buy more ARs. No reason to own anything else. The AR is just an all around better gun.
If this was an AR post I might agree. The SKS come with a bayonet, you can't do a bayonet charge without one! I think for the price the SKS is a winner. Under $400 all day long!
 
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