[Camera man]

I'm and old Mini and AR fan. I have had a few AK's in 7.62x39. A buddy of mine is thinking of getting an AK style rifle in 223. Any input from you guys who know more than I? I have herd some bad things about them, so I told my friend that I would ask you guys. Are they worth buying and if so, witch one is best? And where and what brand of mags are best? Thanx

 

[Flak 2]

camera man. Alot depends on your friends buget ( how much does he want to spend?). I have the Romanian SAR3 and Bulgarian 223. There are also pre ban and post ban Chinese Poly Tech and Norinco 223 AK's out there. Also some Russian 223 AK's being the Vepr and Saigas converted to pistol grip, high cap mag conversions. The SAR3's are the cheapest thing going, but might require a little work on the hammer where it contacts the firing pin. The SAR3 with the steel east German Weiger 30rnd. mags is hard to beat money wise and down right dependable, they'll also work with converted AK74 bakelites. The postban BWK Norincos can be had for $400.00 or so used and are nice rifles but use Norinco mags that are getting hard to find and are costly, about $30.00 a pop used. The Robinson Arms Vepr is a very well made rifle and can be had in 16" and 20" barrel these are built on a heavier reciever and trunnion than regular AK's and weigh around 10lbs. with the 20" tube. They use converted AK74 (5.45x39) magazines with Robinson Arms followers in them. So some ball park prices would be new SAR3 about $340.00, weiger mags $20.00 ea., New Vepr $550.00. converted AK74 bakelite mags $20.00 ea. Used Norinco in 223 around $400.00-450.00.double that for preban. mags $30.00ea. New converted Saiga $425.00-$600.00 depending who does the conversion work. also uses converted AK74 mags. Used Bulgarian K101 (hard to find) $700.00. Bulgarian poly waffle mags $20.00 ea. Poly Tech all I've seen are preban $800.00- $1200.00 mags are specific to this Rifle and very hard to find re. very costly. Some people have tried differant mags in differant rifles with mixed results, like AK74 Bakelites in Norinco rifles ect. Good luck

 

[one good cop]

JUST MY 2 CENTS WORTH THE AK-103 IS A FINE 223 CAL. AK BUILT AROUND THE SAIGA RUSSIAN RECIEVER CHRIS AT AKUSA DOE A FINE JOB PLUS HE HAS SOME COOL VIDEOS OF HIS CRAFT THE MAN KNOWS HIS STUFF . I HAVE BEEN CONSIDERING A 223 AK-47 FOR SOME TIME AND THE FOLKS AT AKUSA ARE THE ONES I'LL BE BUYING MINE FROM UNLESS SOME ONE HAS A MILLED BULGARIAN 101 I COULD BUY.:ar15:

 

[scott-usa]

I was all excited to buy an SAR-3 for $279
at Joeken but then I read about the poor quality
at the link mentioned here to the AK site.

Since I am giving up accuracy I at least need
to be assured of reliability. I would have
bought the Ruger Ranch as it is reliable just
terrible in the accuracy department. So I though
I might as well save some money. I dont know
how to work on guns and dont want to pay the
extra to have a gunsmith fix problems as it would
make more sense to spend the money up front
and get a better rifle.

What I really want is a hunting type semi auto
like the Remington 7400 or Browning BAR
in .223 but they dont make them in .223.
So if it is not the Ruger I have to go
with something military it seems.

I'm ready to spend money but dont want to get
a pig but dont want to spend much either.
Actually I would take a pig if it would be
reliable. I can handly ugly and poor accuracy
as long as I can make noise reliably.

 

[Flak 2]

scott the problems with the SAR3 are simple to fix. Hammer and sites on some rifles need attention. Really if you own any firearm you'll need to learn how to do simple repairs and cleaning maintenance yourself. Firing pins, extractors,ejectors and to the gas system of a semi auto. There is alot of info on video,books,and the net on repair and maintenance for firearms.An AK is probably one of the simplest semi auto rifles to maintain. If you don't want the looks of a military rifle in 223 you'll be limited to a Mini or one of the politically correct looking Saigas that are a NON pistol grip AK action in 223,7.62X39 and 308. The 7400 and BAR were never offered in 223. The people that own the Saigas seem to be happy. The out of the box accuracy will be about the same between the 2 with an edge to the AK. The mini on the other hand can be made more accurate with modifications.

 

[Messiah Jones]

For a flawlessly functioning, affordable, Kalashnikov rifle in .223 the best bet is a Saiga. At $229.00 brand new for a .223 (less for 7.62X39) you can't beat 'em.

They are set up with the sporter/hunting style stock and have only a 10 round capacity. But they are easy to convert to high cap and pistol grip, or you may be able to find one already converted. I bought one last month and had it fully converted in three hours.

Email me for details if you wish to convert one yourself. I sell a Saiga conversion CD.

The SAR-3 rifles are a good way to go also. You have to use East German Weiger mags in them, and the machine work is not quite as good as on the Saigas but at $350.00 they aren't too expensive either. Get the newest SAR-3 possible if you can. The older ones have soft hammers that need to be replaced after a lot of use. Some had canted front sights, and the furniture looks better on the new ones. The SARs are no longer being imported right now. This may change in Sept. 2004 but nobody knows for sure.

After having both and doing the Saiga conversions, my choice would be a Saiga .223. I have one that I converted and it is just more solid and cosmetically appealing. It is heavier than the SAR-3 but I don't mind. The conversion is easy, it looks better, the trigger and safety are smoother, you don't have to worry about canted sights and it is cheaper. Not much of a choice to me.

All other .223 caliber AKs are just too expensive for me. And I believe the Saigas have just as good or better quality than others anyway.

The top rifle is a converted Saiga .223. The bottom rifle is a SAR-2.