[Drache Teufel]

Any one here sort there 9mm brass by head stamp ? Does trimming them all to the same length matter much in terms of accuracy or anything ?

Or is it ok as long as there between spec .744" to .754" I was trimming everything to .750 " before because I had read somewhere that was an ideal length.

Reading on other forums I am seeing alot of people say its a waste of time trimming 9mm.

It wouldn't concern me but I got like close to 3000 pieces to deal with this time and wondering if cutting down on my time would have an effect, especially in accuracy department.

Also does 9mm cases naturally get shorter or do they stretch after so many shootings ? haven't ever bother to test this, but seen it argued both ways.

Any and all concerns/thoughts/ideas welcome

im in no big hurry because i like to prep cases ahead of time and load later, plus i cant find bullets anywhere to load, looking for 124 fmj, cheap stuff etc. Anything around $15-$16 or less for hundred. Currently still punching primers, alot of time on a single stage lol.:wacko:

Thank you

 

[Drache Teufel]

oh don't think it makes a difference but they will be fired in a beretta m9a1 and 92 stainless.

also i got some small rifle primers anyone think I could burn them up using starting loads in the 9mm ? or would i be playing chicken to much ?

 

[blackhawk44]

With the two nines that you list, I would pass on the triming. I have loaded for Berettas, Radoms, HiPowers and an HK P7 and have never seen where trimming might improve groups.
Regarding primers, why not find someone locally reloading for an AR and trade your SR for your needed SP? A locally posted ad should do the trick.

 

[usmc0341]

I definitely wouldn't use the SR primers in the pistol cases but that is just me. THe only time I sorted by headstamp was to try and work out all the variables with my reloads back when I was having troubles with my Kimber Raptor II..

Other than that I have heard that sorting them and reloading different headstamps seperately and performing a "plunk test" with each round will go a long way towards pistol reliability for match shooting. I do the plunk test with each round before I run reloads in my local IDPA matches and have noticed a much reduced stoppage rate. But as always YMMV THis also really applies more to lead projectiles and not jacketed IME.

 

[Drache Teufel]

With the two nines that you list, I would pass on the triming. I have loaded for Berettas, Radoms, HiPowers and an HK P7 and have never seen where trimming might improve groups.
Regarding primers, why not find someone locally reloading for an AR and trade your SR for your needed SP? A locally posted ad should do the trick.

i have some small pistol primers about 1500 so not enough, There is only one local (well 75 miles) shop that deals wit reloading and he is charging $100 for 1000 primers so he can go fly a kite on that. I do not know too many other people that reload and the ones I do know, I don't think they are willing to part with anything or will even let on what they got.

On the trimming ? So It be a waste of time ? Would I see even moderate improvement or none at all ? If one was to go ahead and trimm what length ? Should I check them for undersize, because I ran into that issue with 45-70 hornady brass that was loaded with them revolutions. And yes all I have for 9mm is the two beretta's do they normally have a forgiving chamber ? Looking to load 124 fmj and maybe hp.

 

[Drache Teufel]

I definitely wouldn't use the SR primers in the pistol cases but that is just me. THe only time I sorted by headstamp was to try and work out all the variables with my reloads back when I was having troubles with my Kimber Raptor II..

Other than that I have heard that sorting them and reloading different headstamps seperately and performing a "plunk test" with each round will go a long way towards pistol reliability for match shooting. I do the plunk test with each round before I run reloads in my local IDPA matches and have noticed a much reduced stoppage rate. But as always YMMV THis also really applies more to lead projectiles and not jacketed IME.

im no pistol expert, but by reliability are you talking accuracy or function, because to me reliability is function/cycling. Im not looking for real competitive loads as there is nothing like that where I live. My shooting range is in the woods by myself. Anyway 3-4 inch groups at 25-30 yards I would be happy with. These are gonna be mostly for plinking around, but loaded warm encase they needed to be pressed into defense.

Thanks for your thoughts

 

[usmc0341]

I was talking about reliability.. Reliable function... Making sure all rounds are the proper length to chamber fully and drop out with the barrel turned chamber end down. If they all do this then they will all chamber, extract and eject like they are supposed to..

 

[Drache Teufel]

ok i been doing research recon on beretta forum and thr most seems to agree be trimming isnt really necessary except to make sure it is not longer than max spec or unless really concerned about accuracy, if so some seem to think max case length allowed would make most accurate load also load to max col that mags and reliable function will permit.

Anyone agree, disagree ? and why ?

also anyone know the twist rate on the beretta m9a1, i skimmed the manual and didn't notice in there or on the beretta website. pistol was new early this fall. not sure if they change twist rates often or at all etc.

 

[blackhawk44]

Trying various bullets will yield more reduction in group size than any worry over case length, especially with a tapered case in the Beretta 92. When you can hold a consistant 4 inch group at 25 yards with the loads you have, you will then be ready for serious attempts at load improvement.

 

[Drache Teufel]

Trying various bullets will yield more reduction in group size than any worry over case length, especially with a tapered case in the Beretta 92. When you can hold a consistant 4 inch group at 25 yards with the loads you have, you will then be ready for serious attempts at load improvement.

I guess that makes sense. I'm not any good pistol shooter by any means. I did notice however from going from my old p-85 to this new m9a1 its like I had some sort of special training lol For someone like me that is mediocre shot to notice that I'm way better with another pistol says a lot about a company. Of course I am comparing and old 1985-86 ish pistol to a 2012 so may not be a fare comparison. But the overall designs came about the same time and beretta is still making there's. I still like ruger although I traded the p-85 that I had for 15 + years for a win 94 trails end in .45 colt NIB.

Anyway I'm getting that same conclusion from various forums, don't bother really unless your really good already. So you say focus on bullet design. Do you know beretta's twist rate so I can figure on weight of bullet to start with ?

Also do you think one should at-least sort by head stamps when working up a load ? Possibly don't matter with starting loads, but what about warm loads ?

 

[45K20E4]

Straight walled pistol cartridges rarely lengthen as there is no forward flow of the brass as there is in a shouldered rifle casing.

I have never trimmed straight walled pistol cases....ever. I have all manner of cartridges that have been loaded dozens of times and still work great.

Headstamp: Headstamps matter in rifles when precision shooting, where long barrels and consistent case volume effect burn time and muzzle velocity. In pistols I have never seen this make a difference. The barrels are shorter and amount of powder is minimum by comparison.

Just be consistent in your powder charges, OAL, and get the bullet close to the lands and your accuracy will increase. Being a mil-spec firearm, the M9 likely has a large chamber to make sure it works once it gets built up with grime. The catch 22 here is that if you load long for your pistol, your reloads may not work in other 9mms.

 

[Drache Teufel]

Only plan on loading for my beretta's and do not plan to get another 9mm untill there completely worn out. Probably in 20-30 years lol. Want to stick with one platform so I can get good at least with something.

Ok sounds like sticking with col and constant powder charges will be my only worries, thnks guys. If anyone still has something to add feel free to add I'm always open to suggestions and maybe it will help someone if not me.

 

[WyrTwister]

I also have never trimmed straight wall hand gun brass .

As far as primers , watch the internet sales and buy at least 10,000 at a time . This will make the haz-mat fee , less painful .

I have used a lot of the Russian primers ( they are cheaper ) & they work OK . If in doubt , use them for plinking ammo and American primers for the critical ammo .

God bless
Wyr

 

[medalguy]

I agree. Never ever trimmed pistol cases because when resizing, the brass is pushed down towards the head and nothing causes the brass to lengthen. Also agree with using Russian primers and buy in bulk. I never buy less than 10,000 primers, and if I can, I buy a lot more and just stick them on the shelf until I need them. Wolf/Tula primers work as well as any American primers in my experience. I also have a 92FS and a 92 Compact, a Hi Power, and 1911 in 9, and my ammo works very well in any of these pistols.

BTW I am not a competitive pistol shooter, but like you, shoot just for fun. Tin cans and watermelons, watch out!

 

[MoeMentum]

No sort, No trim. I use the cheapest primers I can find, never a problem, all go bang.

 

[noylj]

Handguns aren't rifles. Some rifles shoot under 1 MOA. A few rifles shoot under 0.2MOA.
A "normal" handgun shoots about 12 MOA.
Thus, any tricks from precision rifle shooting have not effect on handguns.
Accuracy and minimum headspace go together. The 9x19 (9mm Luger) headspace on the case mouth. Trimming will increase head space. Most folks who really try for accuracy with 9x19 use cases that are as close to max length as possible and that means from 0.750-0.754"—I used to do this myself and know that in my guns, it did matter. In fact, if I was to go hunting accuracy with a custom 9x19, I would buy 9x21 cases and trim them to exactly the barrel's throat length—which could be from 0.754-0.776".
Sorting cases? Even a 300fps range in velocity means NOTHING to ballistics out to 25 yards and almost NOTHING out to 50 yards. Sorting doesn't get you any where.
However, if these activities make you feel better about your loads, go for it.

 

[medalguy]

You do know this is a zombie thread, two and a half years old, right?

 

[Rockys Pop]

Even a 300fps range in velocity means NOTHING to ballistics out to 25 yards and almost NOTHING out to 50 yards. Sorting doesn't get you any where.
However, if these activities make you feel better about your loads, go for it.

you're kidding, right?
or talking specifically re: 9mm autoloaders?
I shoot a lot of 25 yard plates and silhouettes......(revolvers) and yeah, velocity matters for my group sizes and POI.

seems to matter more in my stainless guns but in one in particular, as little as 0.2 gr of powder makes the difference between wearing the red center out, and shooting all over the target.