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Erratic ejection and extraction= Looking for input

10K views 90 replies 17 participants last post by  jws360 
#1 ·
Got a new Mini 14 stainless ranch rifle. Finally ran some ammo to run through it and noticed some odd issues which happened with 3 different brands of factory brass ammo. Despite a search I am not sure this has been covered-or at least I don't see it!

Using only factory mags I had 3-4 failures to fully extract. The spend casing was maybe 3/4-7/8 of the way out & then appeared to hang up. Racking the bolt the rest of the way back & letting it slam forward solved the issue.

Also, ejection was all over the place. Most rounds went at a roughly 2-4 o'clock position, which a few others went to 12 and some almost dribbled out by my feet.

I'm at a bit of a loss. Any thoughts or ideas?

Thanks!
 
#3 ·
Got a new Mini 14 stainless ranch rifle. Finally ran some ammo to run through it and noticed some odd issues which happened with 3 different brands of factory brass ammo. Despite a search I am not sure this has been covered-or at least I don't see it!

Using only factory mags I had 3-4 failures to fully extract. The spend casing was maybe 3/4-7/8 of the way out & then appeared to hang up. Racking the bolt the rest of the way back & letting it slam forward solved the issue.

Also, ejection was all over the place. Most rounds went at a roughly 2-4 o'clock position, which a few others went to 12 and some almost dribbled out by my feet.

I'm at a bit of a loss. Any thoughts or ideas?

Thanks!
Did you tear it down and clean it first. Have you ran atleast a couple hundred rounds through it?
 
#5 ·
Yes and almost.



Yes, I tore it down & did a full cleaning & lube before firing. I use SLIP2000 grease & oil. I am used to this platform as I have some M14s.

No, I didn't do 200 rounds. Perhaps 150 +/-.

I hadn't heard these need 200+ rounds to break in. My Kahr pistol specifically so states, however.

I've never had a rifle with such erratic ejection. Most tend to place spent brass in a specific general area. This one was 75% in one area, 15 in another and 10% all but dribbling in front of me.

Weird.
 
#12 ·
Usually the brand new Minis fling the brass at 3 o'clock with considerable force & distance of which many postings are dedicated to resolving. You've got the opposite problem. This makes me think:
Too strong of a recoil spring?
Too small of a gas port bushing (or some restriction to gas flow)?
Ejector not hitting the brass properly to kick it out?

The suggestion to call Ruger is a good starting point. After installing a rear 1911 recoil buffer and smaller diameter bushing mine throws multiple loads at about 2 o'clock 6-12 feet out.
 
#13 ·
Good point all.



Let's see:

1) I have a factory recoil spring

2) Factory gas port which I did clean

3) Ejector? I don't think so, but of course could be wrong. Had 3-4 rounds fired cases get about 3/4 way of of the chamber and stop. The bolt didn't go back far enough to start to chamber a new round.

If I had to guess, I either had really weird ammo from 3 sources or some sort of erratic gas pressure, perhaps due to the gas block, gas port or spring.

Since it is new I'll call Ruger tomorrow and will mention this and the 3 new factory 10 round mags that won't release from their Ruger branded Hogue stock.

Hmm....I wonder if the stock could be a factor? It a Hogue stock, but from Ruger directly. I doubt it, but ya never know.
 
#16 ·
I'll hit two questions at once

It seemed better with the original stock, but then again I only put 50 or so through it, so I can't say for sure.

No, I didn't pay Ruger for the stock. I had a Hogue one from Midway that was a problem. Ruger, much to my amazement, sent me one of theirs at no charge.

I'll have to put the original hard plastic (yuck) stock back on and see if there is a difference.

Kinda hard to believe a simple stock would make such a difference, but I suppose its possible.

A but annoying. Never had such issues before.
 
#20 ·
It seemed better with the original stock, but then again I only put 50 or so through it, so I can't say for sure.

No, I didn't pay Ruger for the stock. I had a Hogue one from Midway that was a problem. Ruger, much to my amazement, sent me one of theirs at no charge.

I'll have to put the original hard plastic (yuck) stock back on and see if there is a difference.

Kinda hard to believe a simple stock would make such a difference, but I suppose its possible.

A but annoying. Never had such issues before.
Its always worth a try. How often is it something incredibly basic that causes an issue but we take for ever to get to that point cuz we are sure its something more complicated.
 
#25 ·
and for the record...

Im pretty sure my first kid was due to an erratic ejection and extraction

I understand how frustrating it can be
Yeah, and maybe your sights were off. too! Then again, your targets can only be about 1" apart! (getting' a little dirty/tacky here, so bear with me- no offense intended to anyone, just some fun)/
 
#27 ·
Different brands of ammo will eject different, different burn rates in powder. Also look at the liner and see if it is rubbing the bottom of the oprod. It could be the trigger group giving more pressure in the Hogue stock.
 
#28 ·
I'm a old dude, ex army, and on my second Mini. First one was a 181 series bought new, and the current one is a 186 series bought new in 96. Never shot tons of rounds thru either one of them, it was expensive to me back then, however, have never had ANY FTF FTE or any other stoppage on either of the two Minis. The only "upgrade" I did to the second one was a Butler Creek folding stock and sling. Functions great and I can engage a man sized target out to 200 meters still with my 64 year old eyes. Sounds to me like your problem is self induced. The stock. Like one other dude wrote, no break in required on a good Mini. Hope you get it fixed.

Reb
 
#29 ·
I have a 184 stainless that was smooth as silk out of the box. The 581 stainless I bought last year had much tighter tolerances and much rougher finish. The first 100 rounds, I had 6 failure to ejects. I had some dribble out and others shoot 20'. I polished all the contact surfaces and put rubbing compound in the receiver and hand cycled it about 100 times. Everything smooth out and I had no more problems. If you don't polish it, it will take about 300 rounds to break in. It is smooth as my 184 now and super reliable. Haven't had a single FTE or FTF since.

Also, dumb question but did you put the liner in the Hogue stock. I have a Hogue on mine but it didn't come with a liner and I had to use the one out of my factory plastic stock. The ejection pattern on the 581 should be about 4 o'clock and about 15-20' unless you change the gas bushing or add a buffer.
 
#30 ·
Yes, the liner is in.

I have a 184 stainless that was smooth as silk out of the box. The 581 stainless I bought last year had much tighter tolerances and much rougher finish. The first 100 rounds, I had 6 failure to ejects. I had some dribble out and others shoot 20'. I polished all the contact surfaces and put rubbing compound in the receiver and hand cycled it about 100 times....

Also, dumb question but did you put the liner in the Hogue stock. I have a Hogue on mine but it didn't come with a liner and I had to use the one out of my factory plastic stock. The ejection pattern on the 581 should be about 4 o'clock and about 15-20' unless you change the gas bushing or add a buffer.
Yes, the liner/heat shield is in place and correctly located. I had ejections at 2, 4 and 12 o'clock as well as a few 1-2' in front of me.

I called Ruger today. The rep will speak to the Mini 14 tech and get back to me. I'd rather a right answer than a rushed one.

I do agree with the poster who called it self induced. The stock certainly seems to be the issue here. I suspect it is just too snug & interferes with the action and gas block, hence the change in point of impact, poor/erratic ejection and difficulty getting some mags out unless I unlatch the trigger group.
 
#32 ·
More the action than heat shield area.



Seems to me to be more the action than the heat shield, especially since some mags won't come out w/o unlatching the trigger group.

I've got a call into Ruger. Said they'd get back to me in a day or so. I'll hang tight & see what they suggest.
 
#34 ·
If the stock is too long it binds everything with the trigger group. Ideally you want the stock to barely be tight length wise. There are thread that talk about free floating the gas block end and bedding it.
 
#36 ·
One other thing you may want to look at. On my Hogue stock I noticed that the liner would not go all the way back and there was a gap between the front end of the liner and the stock. This caused the stock to be too long with the liner sticking out slightly in the front. I found the back end was hitting up against one of the reinforcment ribs in the stock and I had to lift the liner up slightly in the rear to push the liner over the rib and all the way into the stock. After that every fit perfect.
 
#37 ·
Good thoughts, but don't think the liner is the issue.



Good idea, but I did check the liner. It is snugly in place as far back as it can go. In fact, I believe the Ruger mini 14 tech installed the liner himself.

Ruger was supposed to get back to me today. I'll have to call them tomorrow. Don't want to be an annoying person & call 3X/day!

I need to get back to the range & try the rifle again with the factory stock again just to make sure I am right. Really hard to do during the week & can't go this weekend. I may have a few minutes tomorrow for the smaller range just to test it.
 
#40 ·
Good idea

Sounds to me like your gas block is clogged or not working properly. I'd check it to see if there's some sort of obstruction or improperly installed.
Checked it as best I could. Seems OK. But---all worked well with the factory synthetic stock. I think the Hogue stock is too tight in several areas & binds both the action and mag well. Changing the point of impact is a little harder to explain, but I am guessing that pressure somewhere is doing this. Need to re-test with the factory stock & see if I need to move the rear sight back to where it was.
 
#41 ·
Now I am good and stumped....

I am good and stumped....

Went back to the range and tested the '14 with the factory stock & factory Black Hills 55g .223 ammo.

Out of 30 rounds I had 2 jams (failures to fully extract) and erratic ejection. Some cases went 3' and others 20'

Never heard back from Ruger so I left the rep I'm dealing with a message. I suspect it needs to go back to them.

I've attached some pics of 2 different jams.
 

Attachments

#42 ·
With bolt closed, does the oprod fit tight on the gas pipe? It may need to wear in till smooth, my 6.8 was tight fitting on the gas pipe so I polished a little.
 
#44 ·
Gave up, sent it to Ruger.

I gave up fiddling with it.

Sent it to Ruger with an RMA. All I can do is wait and see.

In my letter to them I printed a copy of one of the pics I posted above to show them. I also put the Ruger branded Hogue stock back on with a factory 10 rounder in place, but stuck in good. Maybe they can sort it out. Damned if I can!
 
#47 ·
At long last, an update.

At long last, an update.

The rifle is on its way back to me.

Ruger tells me they did the following:

Replace Bolt lock
Replace Extractor
Replace Op rod ("Slide" as they call it)

I also had weird issues with a various factory mags not fitting with a Ruger branded Hogue stock. They supposedly also sent me some new mags & suggested that I return for exchange any others which do not work right.

Couldn't get the rifle today, so I'll try to test it this weekend & report back.
 
#48 ·
Have you ever had that jam up on the last round in the mag? If you load one round per mag and fire does the bolt always lock back?

I suppose with a bad opp rod you could of had some binding....if the extractor was bad I would have thought it would have lost the case rim.....but maybe they replaced the ejector?

Anyways hopefully they got it fixed!
 
#49 ·
Never had that issue.



Never had an issue with the last round. Problem was erratic extraction/ejection. I was told they replaced the extractor, Op rod and bolt stop. Odd that so many parts would require replacement on a new rifle. Still wondering why.
 
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