The Rise And Decline Of Glock - Shooting Sports Forum


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Old 02-06-2017, 13:22   #1
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The Rise And Decline Of Glock

In 1982 when Glock hit the streets it was thrown to the forefront of the gun control battle by having a polymer frame. The anti-gun leftist claimed a Glock would slip past airport metal detectors. The anti-gun media did one thing, they gave Glock all the free advertising the company could want.

From 1982 – 1986 I was in high school. Something teenagers did back then is we watched the news. Video games were far and few between. There was no internet, smart phone or tablet. there was no Netflix, Youtube, Hulu or amazon prime. The vast majority of people had 3 or 4 TV channels we picked up with an antenna. From 5:30 – 6:30 the only thing to do was watch the news. So watch the news we did.

Even after I graduated high school in 1986 I remember the anti-gunners beating the gun control drum over the Glock.

Handgun Evolution

In the 1950s, 1960s, 1970s most of the police carried Smith and Wesson revolvers. That all changed in the 1980s. Police departments dropped revolvers and replaced them for 9mm semiautomatic handguns. Police departments all over the nation were faced with an ever increasing illegal drug and gang problems. Six rounds from a revolver were no longer enough.

Civilians and police departments alike followed the Army test for the new M9 handgun. So when police departments and federal law enforcement agencies went looking for a new high capacity handgun, they looked to the military test for guidance.

The Army used the 1911 until the 1980s. People said the 1911 was not going anywhere. The 1911 had severed World War I, World War II, Korea, Vietnam and several other conflicts all over the world. It had proven itself time and time again. However, the U.S. military wanted something with less recoil and a higher capacity magazine.

After the Beretta M9 was adopted by the U.S. military, people said Beretta was not going anywhere. Here we are 30 years after its adoption and the M9 is being called outdated.

If Beretta is outdated, then the Glock is also outdated, as they were released and adopted at the same time.

People said Colt was not going anywhere. They had been the main supplier of the M4 and M16 for decades, then Colt lost their military contracts. Colt, who has been in business for over 179 years, filed for bankruptcy protection.

Colt also refused to make any offerings that the everyday consumer wanted. Colt makes a niche product, the M4, M16 and 1911. In 2005 Colt discontinued their famous Colt Python revolver.

Who also makes a niche product? Glock.

Army Adopts New Handgun

Why didn’t Glock enter the military trials of the 1980s? Because the U.S. military wanted certain features that Glock did not offer, such as either a safety or a de-cocker and a lanyard attachment.

For those of you who do not know what a decocker is, it is a lever on the handgun and safely lowers the hammer. Some decockers, such as on the Beretta 92F, also disable the trigger while the safety is on.

Glock offers no way to disable the handgun without unloading it.

In over 30 years Glock has made no substantial changes to their handguns. There are the various generations, but the company refuses to adapt to evolving military requirements and wants of the civilian market.

Here we are, more than 30 years later, and Glock still does not offer a handgun with the features the U.S. military requires. Gun companies were forced to adapt to what the U.S. military wanted. Glock on the other hand refuses to evolve.

What happens when something refuses to evolve? It becomes irrelevant and eventually fades away. As in the case of Colt, bankruptcy.

Nothing New

In more than 30 years Glock has refused to offer a handgun that deviates from their original offering. Why is that?

In more than 30 years Glock has not introduced a rifle, shotgun, carbine or anything else that would appeal to gun owners.

As other companies engineer new and innovative products, Glock offers the same product it did in the 1980s. There have been some minor changes to the Glock line of handguns, but overall they are the same as they were in the 1980s.

By definition, Glock is outdated technology. They are using the same products that were designed over 30 years ago.

Sig Sauer P320 XM17 Project

Sig Sauer, one of the forerunners in the military trials of the 1980s won the XM17 project with their modular handgun design. The trigger can be taken out and put into another frame. This means owners who have a full sized handgun, can order a polymer frame, take the trigger assembly out and put it into a compact frame.

The trigger assembly has the serial number, not the frame, which is a deviation from past decades of serial number standardization.

One of the requirements was a picatinny rail. Glock has an accessory rail instead of a picatinny rail. Rather than adding a picatinny rail to their handguns, Glock held to their own personal standards and went with the accessory rail.

Ignoring the picatinny rail requirement is just one of the issues with Glock and their refusal to evolve.

Rather than giving the U.S. military what they wanted, Glock ignored the requirements and Sig Sauer won the contract.

Ignoring Change

By ignoring changes in the civilian market and evolving military requirements, Glock is ensuring its downfall.

Glock helped set the standard in striker fired handguns. However, with new products such as the CZ 75, CZ P10, Beretta APX, Smith & Wesson M&P, Walther PPQ M2 and various others, Glock is losing ground.

Fanboys cling to Glocks as if it were still a leader in the handgun market. In all honesty, Glock has not been a leader in the handgun market for a long time.

With so many new and innovative product hitting the market, Glock will have to play catchup or fade away into obscurity.

This article originally appeared on SurvivalBoards.com.
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Old 02-06-2017, 20:53   #2
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The reports of the demise of Glock are greatly exaggerated.
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Old 02-07-2017, 02:05   #3
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I must be an anachronism........I still carry a 1911 and probably always will.
so does my Wife.....and Son.......
our last name isn't Luddite, I swear!
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Old 02-07-2017, 06:06   #4
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glocks are like ar15s everyone has one. they are so stupid easy to use and shoot and the aftermarket is so huge i dont think they care.the best part about a glock is if you loose one its easy to replace cause there all the same.1911s and browning HPs are more ind guns you have to make them yours and some just plain wont shoot good.not so with glocks.and everyone and there brother is making glocks in one form or another cz being the latest to make there own copy so i dont see them going anywhere.
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Old 04-16-2017, 13:07   #5
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I own one striker fired pocket pistol. I refuse to own any more striker fired guns. All of my pistols are DA/SA with a decocker. I have enough already, but may look at a Sig when the military model comes out. Everything I have must have an external hammer. As for COLT, I love their AR rifles.
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Old 04-17-2017, 11:13   #6
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Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
....... Colt also refused to make any offerings that the everyday consumer wanted. Colt makes a niche product, the M4, M16 and 1911. In 2005 Colt discontinued their famous Colt Python revolver.
More correctly: 'Colt makes niche products.'

....... Glock offers no way to disable the handgun without unloading it.
Yes, and no. A decocker does NOT 'disable' a pistol. That round is still inside the chamber; and during disassembly it CAN become a problem — Depends on the gun!

In over 30 years Glock has made no substantial changes to their handguns. There are the various generations, but the company refuses to adapt to evolving military requirements and wants of the civilian market.
Au contraire! Glock GmbH/Inc. has made numerous highly significant changes to the: basic design, materials, and manufacture of Glock pistols. Nowadays, Glock pistols use softer metal and internal components than ever before. There's no more Tenifer treatment; and the internal plating is thinner and wears out quicker than on any of the earlier Glock pistols.

Just try doing the famous '25˘ polishing job' on a 4th generation Glock in the same way that could be done on the 1st through mid-serial number range 3rd generation Glock pistols.

Do this and you'll quickly discover how very much the metal and plating have changed for the worse, rather than for the better! What is more, today's slide finish absolutely sucks when compared to the superior manganese-phosphate and polymerized oil finish that Glock, GmbH/Inc. used to use.

In more than 30 years Glock has refused to offer a handgun that deviates from their original offering. Why is that?
No, actually Glock has. Take, for instance, the now defunct Glock Model 21's with the ambidextrous magazine release, AND Picatinny rail. These pistols did NOT work properly; and Glock ended up taking all of them back. All the customer had to do was make a formal complaint; and he got his choice of another (conventional design) Glock pistol.

As other companies engineer new and innovative products, Glock offers the same product it did in the 1980s. There have been some minor changes to the Glock line of handguns, but overall they are the same as they were in the 1980s.
Again, the 'changes' in Glock's choice of materials and methods of manufacturing — as well as the type of final finished product Glock produced — have been considerable. Unfortunately, however, none of these 'manufacturing changes, modifications, and shortcuts' have ever produced an improved Glock pistol. (Quite the opposite, actually!) The original Glock pistol has just kept on getting crappier and crappier, and cheaper and cheaper to produce.

One of the requirements was a picatinny rail. Glock has an accessory rail instead of a picatinny rail. Rather than adding a picatinny rail to their handguns, Glock held to their own personal standards and went with the accessory rail.
Yeah, they did! However Glock hasn't had much success with Picatinny rails in the past; and, as many of us now realize, Gaston is an amazingly cheap old codger who, in the past, has proved to be highly resistant to producing a new polymer mold for any pistol design that he wasn't actually already turning a profit on.

The other characteristic about this amazing German (Ok, 'Austrian') company is that, FOR DECADES NOW, Glock GmbH/Inc. has used the completely free services and concomitant 'field testing' of the average (dumbass) American consumer in order to test and verify the usefulness of ALL new model Glock pistols.

Glock has never done their own preliminary field testing. The American consumer has always had to do this for them! (Who could ever forget the NYC Police Department and that Glock factory repair fiasco at 'Rodman's Neck'!)

Ignoring the picatinny rail requirement is just one of the issues with Glock and their refusal to evolve. ...... Rather than giving the U.S. military what they wanted, Glock ignored the requirements and Sig Sauer won the contract.
Again, yes and no! What really killed Glock's chances of winning the recent Army contract was the ABSOLUTELY AMAZING screwup Glock GmbH/Inc. made with their prototype Glock Model 17M. For ALL of the reasons cited above these new, loudly touted, 'military model' Glock pistols weren't even able to keep their slides attached to their frames during simple dry-firing practice sessions!

(This outrageous problem, in and of itself, is an incredibly sorry situation. Let's face it: It would have been criminal for the United States Army to seriously consider any pistol, of any manufacture, for general military issue that couldn't even be guaranteed to hold itself together!)

Glock's sins have finally managed to start catching up with the: always too proud, always too indifferent, always too cheap, always too clever, and always too arrogant parent corporation.

Once, after I'd 'dicked around' for several months with a brand new and troublesome Glock pistol, some guy who calls himself 'Fred' at Glock's Smyrna headquarters told me to, 'Learn to live with it because that's all we're going to do for you.'

Well, OK, Fred. Now you can learn to 'live with it' too. Ha, ha, ha!



NOTES: A couple of other things! These several items occurred to me while I was lying in bed, last night, trying to fall asleep:

Glock has, and has always had, a lanyard hole molded into the bottom of the backstrap. Various manufacturers offer lanyards designed to either fit into this hole, or else attach to an accessory 'butt plug' that also fits into the bottom of the frame. Adding a lanyard to the basic Glock design is an easy requirement for the factory engineers to meet!

Glock didn't lose the previous military bids (and 'quasi-bids') they've taken a look at. Glock GmbH/Inc. lost the military's interest simply because whenever the factory deviated, EVEN SLIGHTLY, from the basic Glock design, THE MODIFIED PISTOLS NEVER WORKED!

Moreover, Glock has to be very careful with any attempted modification(s) to the front dustcover. 'Why'? Because Glock frames are made of completely unreinforced 'D6' polymer; and, unlike Steyr pistols, there's no steel underframe.

Consequently, anytime a Glock's dust cover is made more rigid, what happens? ....... The frame and slide can start to intermittently bind up against one another — Which is something you really do NOT want to happen!

Glock, GmbH/Inc. KNOWS this; and it's the principal reason that Glock's attached pistol lights have plastic rather than the stiffer metal frames used on other competitive attached tactical lights.
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Old 04-18-2017, 20:00   #7
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I feel sorry for all those LEOs that are stuck with their Glocks from now until hell freezes over due to their low bid procurement process.
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Old 04-19-2017, 17:44   #8
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You evolve or die as competition catches up.
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Old 04-22-2017, 11:28   #9
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Originally Posted by KSDeputy View Post
I own one striker fired pocket pistol. I refuse to own any more striker fired guns. All of my pistols are DA/SA with a decocker. I have enough already, but may look at a Sig when the military model comes out. Everything I have must have an external hammer. As for COLT, I love their AR rifles.
The Sig P320 which won the M17 contract does not have an external hammer. It is striker fired like a Glock, but does not include a trigger bar safety. The only difference in the M17 and commercial P320 is the addition of an external safety, which the current commercial P320 does not have.

FWIW, the stock trigger on my P320 is far better than the stock trigger on my Glock 17, and to me the P320 just feels better in my hands - although I realize that's a totally personal thing.
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Old 04-22-2017, 15:29   #10
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meh

I love my Glocks.
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Old 04-26-2017, 17:38   #11
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On the other hand, I do not own a Glock. My preference is to hammers and decockers and also NO polymer frames.
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Old 04-27-2017, 04:59   #12
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Originally Posted by BengalBacker View Post
meh I love my Glocks.
OK, BB, love this! With everything I ended up doing to it I spent more than twice the price of a standard G-19; and it still ain't perfect!

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Old 04-28-2017, 07:26   #13
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Thanks for the information. If I need a new pistol, I will buy one of the sigs that is DA/SA, external hammer, with decocker.
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Old 05-03-2017, 18:52   #14
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Didnt used to be a Glock fan until I bought a 43 for ease of concealment. It took me a coupe hundred rounds to stop pulling my shots left but now I shoot it straight. Since then I bought a police trade in Glock 21. The gun shop I got it from added a stainless steel guide rod, night sights, and a trigger job. It has holster wear but it shoots better than any 45 Ive ever owned. I have a Sig 229 in 40 caliber and a few revolvers but I really like the two glocks I own.

Its funny to watch everyone scramble to get a Sig P320 now that the military is going to them. Im not really hard to please just give me some thing accurate and reliable. I would like to have a WaltherPPQ either a 9mm or .45acp.
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Old 06-24-2017, 23:22   #15
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I have a Glock 19, a 20, a 23, a 26 and a 30S. Wife has a 19 and a 26. Never had a single malfunction. I literally trust them with my life.
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