Where are the world's petrodollars going? [Archive]

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freesw

08-18-2008, 03:19

Which countries export the most oil?
1. Saudi Arabia
2. Russia
http://www.eia.doe.gov/cabs/Russia/Background.html

These two nations benefit most from high oil prices. Our nation's oil addiction, even if we aren't purchasing directly from Russia, helps keep the price per barrel high. Even if we boost domestic production, our high rates of oil consumption props up the price of oil on the world market. Seems if we can't change our habits we're stuck with massive negative balances of trade with Saudi Arabia, China and now, indirectly, Russia.

We have to wean ourself off gasoline. The only real question is, how bad will we let it get first. Based on current levels of denial, it will get very bad.

billdeserthills

08-18-2008, 10:29

Unfortunately for me, my business is as a Locksmith/ Gundealer. Gun Dealing doesn't waste a lot of gas as I only need to get myself to my store, but locksmithing is not as easy. I own two very weighted down vehicles and while I can only drive one at a time, I still have to spend money on gas to keep them running. How else can I bring an unknown quantity of locks & lock parts to my client? There is no way for me to know just what I may need on any particular job so I bring it all. At least that way I can avoid making a return trip with the "right" part later. I have looked into other fuel sources like propane& natural gas, but what's the point. Prices on fuel are carefully weighed to make as sure as possible that the consumer gets to pay about the same amount no matter which particular fuel you might buy. In addition to that I will need to pay thousands of dollars on each vehicle to upgrade it so it will burn the propane/natural gas. Seems cheaper to keep burning gas.

freesw

08-18-2008, 11:05

If most Americans would at least begin to consider their driving habits, that would be a good start. Then weighing gas mileage a bit more as a factor when purchasing a vehicle. Considering how two or more destinations can be combined into one trip, rather than driving to the store for one or two items as often. Walking for exercise when the distance is short and the weather fine. And it would also help a lot of fewer people would disparage those of us who are trying to reduce our nation's overall gasoline consumption. Disagree with a particular method if you must, but if we do not reduce overall consumption, the prices are going to go back up way above the $4/gallon we just saw (I guess it's still that high some places, but appears to be going back down a bit). Then those that have to drive a lot for work or who live in rural and suburban areas are really going to be "over a barrel." Like during WWII, if everyone does their part, gasoline addiction need not drive us into the gutter of nations.

COBRADOC

08-18-2008, 17:22

..... We have to wean ourself off gasoline. The only real question is, how bad will we let it get first. Based on current levels of denial, it will get very bad.

We will never completely wean ourselves off gasoline - to be more specific, we will never wean ourselves off oil. Name any of the alternatives that are being dreamed up to replace gasoline, and we will still need oil. There are too many byproducts other than gasoline that we need.

What we have to do is wean ourselves off FOREIGN oil. Because if we continue to transfer trillions of American dollars to foreign countries for their oil, it will bankrupt our economy.

The only way to do that is to access our own resources. There is hope for some of the proposed alternatives, that can supplement the demand for oil, but most of them are mere unaffordable pipe dreams. Where geo or hydro production of electricity is not feasible, the best alternative is nuclear. Oil is available in abundance through drilling, shale and coal gasification. This can be done clean and safe, and we have enough of the raw resources to last for several hundred years.

When it comes to hybrid automobiles, lots of folks are getting all excited over hybrids – but this is very short-sighted. The problem comes 5, 8, maybe 10 years down the road when all those batteries start having to be replaced. What do you do with the old batteries? Talk about an environmental nightmare – but nobody is thinking that far down the road. But we should be.

freesw

08-18-2008, 17:31

We will never completely wean ourselves off gasoline

I agree completely. That doesn't mean we shouldn't conserve and reduce our overall consumption of oil.

We'll have to sooner or later, and the longer we wait, the more problems will result from our procrastination.

What we have to do is wean ourselves off FOREIGN oil.

A distinction without a difference.

mnottfam

08-18-2008, 17:57

What I don't understand is why I can drive a Corvette-engined 2004 GTO and get 27 MpG out of it, but yet your average family car with a V-6 only gets the same?:blink: If things were equal, a V-6 would be getting about 40-45 MpG, and your little 4-poppers would be getting 55-70. My 350 Hp GTO doesn't have any additional goodies for additional fuel-efficiency added yet, either. I'm reasonably expecting to get up to around 32-33 with it by the time I'm done with it. Heck, even my 11 year old full-size truck is now breaking 20 MpG after having added a number of goodies.

Sorry, but the auto-makers claims that we all have to be driving these stupid, boring little econ-boxes like Prius's to get that kind of MpG doesn't wash. My folks had an '84 Mercury Lynx wagon with the Mazda 4 cyl diesel and a 5 spd in it. That machine regularly got 53 MpG during the summer, with as high as 58 not uncommon. What's that? You say you've never heard of a 4 cyl diesel Escort? Not too many people have. My take is that they got TOO GOOD of MpG for the Blue oval to produce very many of. They were relatively uncommon when they made them '84-'86.

With the high price of gas these days, I think the marriage-made-in-hell that the auto makers signed with the oil companies is coming full-circle to bite them in the hind-end.

It's hard not to see some kind of relationship going on here. Speculation has abounded for years on the subject, yet when people try to research the claim to find substantiation, it ends in dead-ends. You know the types: "...I had a friend of a friend of an uncle whose cousin's next door neighbor had a distant-removed relative who designed a carburetor that got 75 MpG, and a big oil company bought the rights to it from him and told him to never build another one..." Or one of my personal favorites, "...this guy I knew had a 55 Ford that he bought brand-new. For some reason he was able to travel all over the state and still had fuel left in the tank. The dealer called a short time later and told him it was a factory prototype that was shipped out by mistake, and they'd buy it back from him for whatever he wanted, so he traded it for a brand new Lincoln and $5,000 cash, and regretted it almost immediately, as that things MpG was HORRIBLE!!!..." Never substantiated. Yet for some odd reason, these stories abound. Could there be any truth to them? Seems to be too many of them out there for there not to be some truth in them somewhere.

Your guess is as good as mine. All I know is something's not right...

moonie42

08-18-2008, 19:27

COBRADOC

08-18-2008, 20:20

mnottfam,

what have you done to your full-size to boost your mpg? I've got a '04 Dakota quad-cab with the 4.7L V8. I'm getting between 17 and 20, but would love to see what I can get out of it.

Thanks!

Interesting. I have the same truck, only an '03. And I also would like to know what mnottfam is doing to his V8 to improve the MPG.

BE (before ethanol) I got 20-21 MPG on the highway and 17-18 around town. Since Florida went almost 99% Ethanol my highway milage has dropped to around 18 and my in-town to just above 15. One of the stations close to me has just switched back to non-ethanol gas and there is always someone at the pumps, even if the price is a couple cents higher. I will become a steady customer.

mnottfam

08-18-2008, 20:21

>Bak-flip tonneau cover
>BBK underdrive pulleys
>Perma-cool electric fans
>K&N FIPK filter and housing kit
>Wal-Mart "SuperTech" full synthetic 5w30 oil, every 2500 miles change the filter & add a qt, at every 5000 miles, change OIL & filter
>swapped out the drum-equipped open rear for a limited slip disc equipped unit
>NO ALCOHOL. 10% alcohol = 20% DROP IN MpG!!

17.5 MpG before, now getting 20.7 MpG. ALL DOCUMENTED.

Sorry: 1997 F-150, 4.6 V-8, 4x4 Xcab, 5 speed

billdeserthills

08-19-2008, 05:40

mnottfam

08-19-2008, 05:51

Well, if you'd actually read it, I'm getting 27 out of a GTO.

markw76

08-19-2008, 19:28

I'm pretty well convinced there is a whole lot of wasted burning of gasoline in this country, most of it in the more populated areas. Not combining trips, having demands on you all over the countryside instead of just in your neighborhood, the "I gotta have a ice cream!" attitude all contribute to it. Until we get back to "living local", it will continue. I don't drive out to the big box discounter anymore, the neighborhood True Value is just fine, since what I save at the big box ends up in the tank eventually. I personally hope the price of fuel stays up (except for commercial users) so more people feel the hurt loud and clear. Smaller vehicles, scooters, even bicycles will encourage a more local mindset, and businesses will fill that niche.