November 7 - Judgement Day

[Dutch Nick]

Well, the Grand Old Party has managed to do it again... take what could have been, perpetual control of both Houses of Congress and pull defeat from the jaws of victory.

Cry, whine and moan all you want... all indications are that come November 8th, the Democrats will be in charge of one, maybe both Houses.

My personal feeling is that the Democratic Party is at least as corrupt as the Republicans are... maybe more. It wasn't that long ago that the Dems gave us the Assualt Weapons Ban and came darn close to enacting even harsher anti-gun legislation.

Nonetheless, all indications are that even hardcore conservatives are either staying home on election day or even plan to vote for the Democratic candidates. What happened? George Bush happened.

I can live with a few years of a Democrat-controlled Congress... I cannot tolerate another Congressional term of rubber-stamping, gutless and spineless "Republicans" who place their glorious leaders wishes above the Bill of Rights.

What we need, come November 7th, is... to paraphrase General George S. Patton... a time of "Holding the Republican Party by the nose and kicking it in the ass."

The Democrats will commit political hari-kari, just as they always do and we'll be back in power within a few years... but hopefully, with a fresh batch of Republicans who have actually read the United States Constitution.

[plinky]

I don`t know...like you said, the Dems are probably just as corrupt as the Neokooks...and there`s still a lot left to screw up. Oh, I wish we had another Ronald Reagan....

[stevekaw]

Without really commenting on the merits of gun control in general, or the AWB in particular, what justification do you have in implying that Democrats were/are "corrupt" just because they supported these measures?

I would be just as incorrect in implying the Republicans are "corrupt" because they are against gun control and the AWB...

[plinky]

Without really commenting on the merits of gun control in general, or the AWB in particular, what justification do you have in implying that Democrats were/are "corrupt" just because they supported these measures?

I would be just as incorrect in implying the Republicans are "corrupt" because they are against gun control and the AWB...

I don`t think that he implied that Dems are corrupt BECAUSE of the AW ban and the gun control proposals.

[Boogyman]

The Republicans are corrupt because they've been in control of everything for too long.

If the Democrats end up controlling everything for too long, the same thing will happen to them.

The trick is to keep a balance of power. That's what the Founders intended.

So if/when the Democrats end up with the Congress or the Senate, the balance will be restored. If they end up with both, at least it will force some accountability in the Whitehouse. For awhile.

[Hoodoo]

Well, gun control is clearly Unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who supports it is corrupt.

[Boogyman]

Well, gun control is clearly Unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who supports it is corrupt.
So by your "logic":

Child predation is clearly illegal and immoral, thus it follows that anyone who supports the Foley cover-up is corrupt.

Bribery is clearly illegal, thus it follows that anyone involved with the Abramoff scandal is corrupt.

The Patriot Act is clearly unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who supports it is corrupt.

Spying on and wiretapping American citizens is clearly unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who does it is corrupt.

These are all present-day realities, so any predictable references to years-past Clinton crap is BS. Just tellin' ya beforehand... :lol:

[Hoodoo]

Yep, I would have to say that anyone who supports something which is illegal is corrupt. References to Clinton's performance, if such is correct is not BS--it's simply the truth. Why are you so adverse to anyone mentioning Clinton's performance? Are you ashamed?

[Olds]

The trick is to keep a balance of power. That's what the Founders intended I agree....

[markw76]

I'd rather think of someone that supports, promotes, or tolerates unconstitutional actions as morally bankrupt. The corruption comes in when they bargain with each other, if you support me on this, I won't vote against you on that. The corruption comes in when influence is pedaled to the highest bidder. You can't make me believe Democrats don't have their little deals going just like the Republicans.
Oh: wasn't it the Democrats that had control of Congress until a couple years ago? Control of Congress seems to sweep back and forth like an RV septic tank's contents on the interstate.
Its a dam**d good thing I vote on issues and not party. This Republicrat slippage from "principle" is ticking me off.
Gaaaagh! :blink:

[Boogyman]

Yep, I would have to say that anyone who supports something which is illegal is corrupt. References to Clinton's performance, if such is correct is not BS--it's simply the truth. Why are you so adverse to anyone mentioning Clinton's performance? Are you ashamed?
Ashamed? :lol: :lol: :lol:

I'd be ashamed if I was a Republican. :lol:

Clinton has been out of office for 6 years. Is that all you got? Nothing relevant to the present? :rolleyes:

[Hoodoo]

Yep. You REALLY don't want any reference made to Slick's regime. Small wonder. LOL>

[markw76]

I don't think any President leaves without some issues the next guy inherits and we get to pay the cleanup bill for. And the "investigation".

[Boogyman]

Yep. You REALLY don't want any reference made to Slick's regime. Small wonder. LOL>
I'm not defending Bill Clinton, he's gone, gone, gone. You're the one that keeps bringing him up.

Your continued "references" just make your arguments look weak, because that's all you got: dragging up Clinton. It's pointless.

It doesn't do anything to justify all the problems you're having with your own GOP party. It doesn't add anything constructive to the debate.

It's so typical. Someone will point out a current issue like the Foley scandal, or the Abramoff scandal, and then some right-winger like you comes along and says: "Well, Clinton blah blah blah...". What's that got to do with the current debate?

Why don't you address the present-day issues instead of trying to divert attention to the past?

You don't hear me dragging Nixon out of mothballs, do ya? :lol:

[Hoodoo]

I merely mention in some instances that Slick or other past Presidents have exhibited some of the same failings that Bush has. YOur criticism in such instances constitutes hypocrisy. YOur democratic partisianship is showing despite your efforts to hide it. No matte r I'll post any way I wish consistent with the Moderator's guidelines.

[ben waller]

this bunch deserves to lose and lose big. having been a big "R" Republican for forty years (yeah I voted for Nixon, you damn right) I can say that.

so here it is: I am voting straight dem nationally, which I have never ever even thought of doing before, in order to get a real discussion and real representative government moving in Washington. how's that? this Republican party needs help, it is very ill, and, just like chemo on cancer, a less than severe treatment just won't do it. so I'm gonna' hold my nose and cast my vote for some democrats I really, really can't stand.

just look at the current crop of bastards in Washington. too damn few of them are worthy of the responsiblities that elected Constitutional offices require. not on either side of the aisle. one side is a bunch of cowboy wannabees and the other is a flock of girly-men. most of them are whores. high-priced whores. they will do any damn thing for money. just follow the money and you'll see it, no trouble at all.

so yeah, honest, competent and reasonable men are in short supply in Washington. how do we know that? competent, reasonable men have dialogue, examine all of the ideas carefully, and achieve consensus when presented a challenging problem. competent, reasonable men do not act like the thugs and scoundrels who have seized our government today. think about it. can concensus be imposed? can concensus be coerced? is concensus rightly fueled by fear or insult?

think about your town at the beginning of the war. was getting all exited about war and driving around town with a huge American flag whipping off the roll-bar of a wheeler truck, even if you do it in convoy, is that concensus? hell no. just emotionalism pure and simple and that can never be reasonable and it does not lead to concensus and it obviously does not return superior results.

so where's that flag today?

you know, this Congress kicked the ball back to the executive when it came time to make the call on Iraq and on the Patriot Act. and the way I read the Constitution, the congress does not have the option to waive its rights like it did before this war. what this Congress did could be prosecuted as dereliction of duty under military law. and speaking of law, Congress sure as hell failed us all in the Patriot Act too. Christ, they passed a body of law that usurps the Peoples' powers as specified in the Constitution and told us all that they were doing it for us, the lying bastards. remember these idiots singing on the steps of the Capitol. remember that?

yep, friends, these folk be way too far over the line for this American.

furthermore, those "investigations" that some might think unimportant are in fact required constantly, no matter what group of predators is in power because we are charged with oversight of our government through the agency of our Congress. our Congress has the job of oversight as well as appropriation. this is outlined clearly in the Constitution. this is the the law of Our Land. read it. inconvenient? yeah. messy? yeah. American? you damn right.

this land is Our Land and we must posses it fully and in the process we are likely to get some bugs in our teeth. good. fine. bring it on.

do not petition a king. do not ask his permission. do not recognize a supreme Decider for there is not such a one in our Consititution.

as for me, I'll damn sure not tolerate this one. as far as I am concerned we should all be way done with all this gang. way done, man.

our Constitution is way more valuable than our collective ass.

grow a pair.

ben

[markw76]

I won't go so far as to vote for someone who backs gun bans, but I won't vote for someone who supported anything that violates the Constitution in other ways either. I'm very open to vote for an up and comer R also tired of business as usual (or worse), or maybe a Constitution Party or Libertarian Candidate. I've come to the conclusion that sending "messages" to politicians is a hit or miss proposition, mostly miss.

[Olds]

Bill Clinton, he's gone, gone, gone.
Well I don't know about that. If some folks have their way he will be our first "Gentleman."

[josh]

So by your "logic":

Child predation is clearly illegal and immoral, thus it follows that anyone who supports the Foley cover-up is corrupt.

Bribery is clearly illegal, thus it follows that anyone involved with the Abramoff scandal is corrupt.

The Patriot Act is clearly unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who supports it is corrupt.

Spying on and wiretapping American citizens is clearly unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who does it is corrupt.



For once you are actually right. Unless we quit making excuses and stop defending the actions of these idiots we are doomed.
Right and wrong are very real no matter what party we are talking about.

[Boogyman]

I merely mention in some instances that Slick or other past Presidents have exhibited some of the same failings that Bush has.
So? What's the point? Like I said, it adds nothing relevant to the present debate.
YOur criticism in such instances constitutes hypocrisy.
WTF? Maybe you should look up "hypocrisy"... Oh, that's right, you never look up anything, or at least you never post any data. So allow me:

"Hypocrisy: The feigning of qualities and beliefs that one does not actually possess or hold, esp. a pretense of piety or moral superiority."

Fits the GOP like a glove, huh? :rolleyes:
YOur democratic partisianship is showing despite your efforts to hide it.
Must be patient with the slow... I told you before, I'm a Libertarian.
The Republicans are corrupt because they've been in control of everything for too long.

If the Democrats end up controlling everything for too long, the same thing will happen to them.

The trick is to keep a balance of power. That's what the Founders intended.
This is my initial statement in this thread, you see any partisanship in there?

Of course, there's no partisanship in this:
Well, gun control is clearly Unconstitutional, thus it follows that anyone who supports it is corrupt.
A clear reference to the Democrats. So you accusing me of "partisanship" is hypocrisy. Busted.

Besides, gun control has nothing to do with the topic.

Get with the program, Hoodoo... I've been doing this a long time and I've seen your type of BS many times. You can't defend the indefensible so you attack the other guy. You learn this crap from your real leader, Karl Rove.

I'm bored with your petty bickering now, and it's not productive in the least.

Bye bye! :lol:

[Boogyman]

this bunch deserves to lose and lose big. having been a big "R" Republican for forty years (yeah I voted for Nixon, you damn right) I can say that.

so here it is: I am voting straight dem nationally, which I have never ever even thought of doing before, in order to get a real discussion and real representative government moving in Washington. how's that? this Republican party needs help, it is very ill, and, just like chemo on cancer, a less than severe treatment just won't do it. so I'm gonna' hold my nose and cast my vote for some democrats I really, really can't stand.

just look at the current crop of bastards in Washington. too damn few of them are worthy of the responsiblities that elected Constitutional offices require. not on either side of the aisle. one side is a bunch of cowboy wannabees and the other is a flock of girly-men. most of them are whores. high-priced whores. they will do any damn thing for money. just follow the money and you'll see it, no trouble at all.

so yeah, honest, competent and reasonable men are in short supply in Washington. how do we know that? competent, reasonable men have dialogue, examine all of the ideas carefully, and achieve consensus when presented a challenging problem. competent, reasonable men do not act like the thugs and scoundrels who have seized our government today. think about it. can concensus be imposed? can concensus be coerced? is concensus rightly fueled by fear or insult?

think about your town at the beginning of the war. was getting all exited about war and driving around town with a huge American flag whipping off the roll-bar of a wheeler truck, even if you do it in convoy, is that concensus? hell no. just emotionalism pure and simple and that can never be reasonable and it does not lead to concensus and it obviously does not return superior results.

so where's that flag today?

you know, this Congress kicked the ball back to the executive when it came time to make the call on Iraq and on the Patriot Act. and the way I read the Constitution, the congress does not have the option to waive its rights like it did before this war. what this Congress did could be prosecuted as dereliction of duty under military law. and speaking of law, Congress sure as hell failed us all in the Patriot Act too. Christ, they passed a body of law that usurps the Peoples' powers as specified in the Constitution and told us all that they were doing it for us, the lying bastards. remember these idiots singing on the steps of the Capitol. remember that?

yep, friends, these folk be way too far over the line for this American.

furthermore, those "investigations" that some might think unimportant are in fact required constantly, no matter what group of predators is in power because we are charged with oversight of our government through the agency of our Congress. our Congress has the job of oversight as well as appropriation. this is outlined clearly in the Constitution. this is the the law of Our Land. read it. inconvenient? yeah. messy? yeah. American? you damn right.

this land is Our Land and we must posses it fully and in the process we are likely to get some bugs in our teeth. good. fine. bring it on.

do not petition a king. do not ask his permission. do not recognize a supreme Decider for there is not such a one in our Consititution.

as for me, I'll damn sure not tolerate this one. as far as I am concerned we should all be way done with all this gang. way done, man.

our Constitution is way more valuable than our collective ass.

grow a pair.

ben
Now, here's a man who's opinion I can respect.

Forty years a Republican, and he has the clarity to see the problems within his own party and the courage to do something about it.

The Republican Party could use more men like you, Ben Waller.