Campaign to abolish Christmas

[Swordslinger]

http://www.noahide.com/xmas.htm
Have you ever wondered where this was coming from? Thought it was just PC stuff to keep from hurting anyones feelins, huh?

I have some comments. I'll save them for know, as these guys say enough about themselves...PLENTY. One should do a search on the "Noahide Laws" they speak of, and the reffernces to the Talmud that they make. Let's just say it makes for some interesting reading. ;)

Campaign to abolish X-mas
celebration by gentiles

Noahide Mivtzaiim materials now available. Anyone interested in obtaining holiday fliers (@ $.25 each) to distribute to their non-Jewish associates, please contact Shmuel or Aaron for more info:

[phone number withheld] www.noahide.com


Why Torah obligates all Jews in this campaign:

"...according to the known Jewish ruling that Christians are idol worshippers." (Likkutei Sichos 37:198)

A gentile...is liable for the death penalty...if he has invented a religious holiday for himself...The general principle is we do not allow them to make new religious rituals and to make 'mitzvahs' for themselves by their own devices. Rather they may either become a Ger Tzeddek and accept all the Mitvahs; or he (the Noahide) should stand fast in his Torah (the seven Noahide Laws) without adding or diminishing...and if he does make some new 'mitzvah,' we lash him, punish him, and inform him that he is obligated with the death penalty for this..." (Rambam Mishne Torah—Hilchos Melachim 10:9)

"...it is however obvious that if it will be perceived by them (the nations), also the matter of the negation of sh**uf, until they even have some recognition of the Unity of Hashem—that 'there is nothing else besides Him'; this will add both in their carefulness and meticulousness in fulfilling the seven Noahide Laws [with all of their ramifications!] and also in their aiding of Jewish people in all of their matters pertaining to Yiddishkeit and all of their needs in general..." (Likkutei Sichos 25: YudTes Kislev)

"Any person who has already worked successfully in this area should try to influence other Jews to do likewise. Resistance should not deter one when attempting to influence a further individual to accept upon himself the task of disseminating the Noahide Laws amongst the nations." (Hisvaduyos 5750 2:18-19)

[cowboy117]

I believe these folks are a tiny minority in the Jewish community.I've had many Jewish girlfriends in the past and have never heard them express any of these beliefs.We always exchanged presents and had a great time at my relatives homes at Christmas time.[my family is Christian]Too much of this political correctness going around,in my opinion.I'm an agnostic myself,but love Christmas time and respect the Christians right to celebrate Jesus' birth.Live and let live. ;)

[Metaldoc]

I read a lot of that website and it is disturbing how much is quietly going on behind the scenes.

That said, as far as abolishing Christmas, I don't see it happening, at least until there is a major upset in the world. There is too much greed in the world and too much money made off of the Christmas holiday. When I was growing up, you did not see or hear anything "Christmas" until after Thanksgiving. Now it has been in some stores since the first of October! Some folks I know have their Christmas shopping done for this year already.

From another perspective, Christ has been effectively removed from Christmas. Many schools can't present the traditional Biblical Christmas stories. Religious displays have been banned from many public buildings and grounds. All advertising centers around merchandise...... buy, buy, buy.

Christmas is (or should be) the celebration of Christ's birth, but it has been corrupted into something else altogether. Perhaps in that sense it has been abolished already.

[stooxie]

Originally posted by Swordslinger@Oct 25 2005, 07:52 PM
http://www.noahide.com/xmas.htm
Swordy,

Ok, I'm going to take a more positive track here.

I just ask one thing: you have to stop finding stange, crack-pot websites
(Jewish or Christian) and thinking they represent the whole world.

99.99% of Jews couldn't give a rat's behind what religion other people are.
I know plenty of Jews that fully enjoy the holiday season, Christmas and all.

So, extrapolate that and know that Jews everywhere are perfectly happy to
live beside their Christian brothers.

Thanks,
-Stooxie

[Swordslinger]

Originally posted by stooxie+Oct 27 2005, 04:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (stooxie @ Oct 27 2005, 04:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-Swordslinger@Oct 25 2005, 07:52 PM
http://www.noahide.com/xmas.htm
you have to stop [/b][/quote]
Uhhh..... Ok? Is this not the religion forum? Or is it just ok to discuss one or two religions here?

Actually, I agree with the Chief Rabbi of the United Hebrew Congregations of the British Commonwealth, Professor Jonathan Sacks, who has made a brilliant suggestion that I most heartily applaud. Let us learn about each others' faiths.
I believe that by finding out about each others' faiths, Jews and non-Jews can build bridges to understanding. It is very Important to understand each other's faith if we are to live side by side. Noone would argue that it is not important to understand the Islamic faith.....would they?
Richard Gephardt, Missouri District 3, served as Democratic Leader of the U.S. House of Representatives, Majority Leader of the House, and as one of the nation's leading Democrats for much of the last two decades.

On March 05, 1991, Rep. Gephardt co-sponsored H.J. Res. 104, which reads in part as follows:

"Whereas Congress recognizes the historical tradition of ethical values and principles which are the basis of civilized society and upon which our great Nation was founded; Whereas these ethical values and principles have been the bedrock of society from the dawn of civilization, when they were known as the Seven Noahide Laws …"

Congressman Robert Michel (R-Ill.) was first elected in 1956 to the 85th Congress from the 18th congressional district in Illinois. He served from his election in 1956 until his retirement in 1994. He was Minority Whip from the 94th Congress through the 96th. He served as Minority Leader, though he preferred the title Republican Leader, from the 97th through the 103rd Congress.

Rep. Michel was co-sponsor of the 1991 declaration concerning the Noahide Laws, along with Rep. Gephardt.

If we have laws being considered by our congressmen concerning the "noahide laws", is it not the right of the American people to know what they are about? I only mention the above "we must abolish Christmas" flier to help other people to understand ONE of the "noahide laws". Just ONE!! I could go further in helping people understand, but since the season is upon us, as is the fliers, I choose only this one. There are more.

Our government under Presidents Reagan, Bush and Clinton, has provided, under the euphemism of education (for example, House Joint Resolution 173 and Public Law 102-14), a groundwork for the establishment of Talmudic "courts of justice" to be administered by disciples of Shneur Zalman's Chabad successor, Rabbi Menachem Mendel Schneerson. Is it not common sense that we inquire as to what a Talmudic "court of justice" is? Heck, most Christians dont even know what a Talmud is. Thanks to the efforts of a few, who dont mind attacks like yours, the truth is getting out. :) I am of the opinion that censoring and hiding the Talmud and its wonderful teachings is no differnet that the book burnings of our not so distant past. More should stand up!! Where is the outcry?

To oppress and censor the Talmud and it's teachings, and the Noahide "laws" from everyones view and bury it could be deemed as "antisemitic", dont you think? The world's religions have been stepping on each other and burning each other's books for millennia. It is time for everyone to put their books on the table. Let's read them exactly as they are written. This is paramount in building the bridge to understanding. :)
99.99% of Jews couldn't give a rat's behind what religion other people are.

That is a mighty big claim. Is there any data, or ancient religious writing that you can reffer me to that say that?
So, extrapolate that and know that Jews everywhere are perfectly happy to
live beside their Christian brothers.
Everywhere???? What about the land of the Israelies??? How do they feel about Christians becoming citizens there? Do they allow Christians to pass out copies of the New Testement openly? And....is this the teaching of the Talmud concerning Christians? Or does the Talmud follow more closley to the Noahide that is mentioned in the flier? :)

If we are going to build the bridges to better understanding, we should know. We can not do that with burying the wonderful teachings of the Talmud concerning their "Christian brothers"

Pharisaism became Talmudism, Talmudism became Medieval Rabbinism, and Medieval Rabbinism became Modern Rabbinism...... when he studies the Talmud, he is actually repeating the arguments used in the Palestinian academies.
— Rabbi Dr. Finkelstein

"The Talmud is the most important book in Jewish culture, the backbone of creativity and of national life. No other work has had a comparable influence on the theory and practice of Jewish life, shaping spiritual content and serving as a guide to conduct."
— Rabbi Steinsaltz

There are two editions of the Talmud; one was composed by Babylonian Jews and one by Jews who lived in ancient Jerusalem. Generally a citation from the Talmud refers to the Babylonian version, which is considered authoritative. The Jerusalem Talmud is not generally taught in even the most Orthodox Jewish schools today, though advanced Talmud scholars sometimes study it.
— Anti-Defamation League

The Editor, Dr. Isidore Epstein, and his band of scholars have produced a translation which is a marvel of skill in dealing with the formidable difficulties which the Talmud presents. (The Soncino Edition)
— The Jewish Chronicle

The Soncino Talmud is … an adornment for any library, a hallmark of intelligent Jewishness in a family ...— Jewish Forum

The rendering is accurate and scholarly … In particular the translators deserve praise for their choice of suitable equivalents for technical terms and phrases that are difficult to turn into another language.
— The Times Literary Supplement

This thread was only to discuss the Jewish Suppremist flier on Christmas. I know not everyone of them follow and believe these things, just as not all Catholics and Christians are child molestors. Right stooxie? But your statements pose a whole list of others questions that we should shed light on. :)

[stooxie]

Ok, I'll start using your "Ignore" button.

-Stooxie

[Swordslinger]

Originally posted by stooxie@Oct 27 2005, 08:54 PM
Ok, I'll start using your "Ignore" button.

-Stooxie
Thank you. :) Would you answer the questions that I asked first?
stooxie statement
So, extrapolate that and know that Jews everywhere are perfectly happy to
live beside their Christian brothers.
Questions regarding statement.
Everywhere???? What about the land of the Israelies??? How do they feel about Christians becoming citizens there? Do they allow Christians to pass out copies of the New Testement openly? And....is this the teaching of the Talmud concerning Christians? Or does the Talmud follow more closley to the Noahide that is mentioned in the flier?

stooxie statement
99.99% of Jews couldn't give a rat's behind what religion other people are.

Questions regarding statement.
That is a mighty big claim. Is there any data, or ancient religious writing that you can reffer me to that say that?* If we are going to build the bridges to better understanding, we should know. We can not do that with burying the wonderful teachings of the Talmud concerning their "Christian brothers"

stooxie statement
you have to stop

Questions regarding statement.
Uhhh..... Ok? Is this not the religion forum? Or is it just ok to discuss one or two religions here?

No one would argue that it is not important to understand the Islamic faith.....would they?

If we have laws being considered by our congressmen concerning the "noahide laws", is it not the right of the American people to know what they are about?

Thank you. :)

[stooxie]

Originally posted by Swordslinger+Oct 27 2005, 01:08 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Swordslinger @ Oct 27 2005, 01:08 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-stooxie@Oct 27 2005, 08:54 PM
Ok, I'll start using your "Ignore" button.

-Stooxie
Thank you. :) Would you answer the questions that I asked first? [/b][/quote]
I'll do something better!

I'll tell you what you want to hear:

Jews, like all non-SwordSlinger Approved Christians, need to die.

Right? That's what your peace-loving Bible says, no?

It's ok, my peace-loving Talmud apparently says YOU need to die.

So, isn't religion grand? The #1 source of ALL KILLING MOTIVATION
ON EARTH.

Ok, I gave you an answer. Now I'm ignoring you and your hate speach
forever.

(even though I know you'll post about 800 lines of scripture to show...
well, something.

-Stooxie

[Swordslinger]

Originally posted by stooxie+Oct 28 2005, 07:02 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (stooxie @ Oct 28 2005, 07:02 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> Originally posted by Swordslinger@Oct 27 2005, 01:08 PM
Originally posted by stooxie@Oct 27 2005, 08:54 PM
Ok, I'll start using your "Ignore" button.

-Stooxie
Thank you. :) Would you answer the questions that I asked first?

Right? That's what your peace-loving Bible says, no?

It's ok, my peace-loving Talmud apparently says YOU need to die.

So, isn't religion grand? The #1 source of ALL KILLING MOTIVATION
ON EARTH.

Ok, I gave you an answer. Now I'm ignoring you and your hate speach
forever.

(even though I know you'll post about 800 lines of scripture to show...
well, something.

-Stooxie [/b]
I'll do something better!

I'll tell you what you want to hear:

Actually, I was shootin for you telling the truth. Just answering the questions that I asked YOU regarding your statements that YOU so boldly made. That's it! Nothing else, and you still havent done it, nor will you.



Right? That's what your peace-loving Bible says, no?

I might need chapter and verse on that one. I am pretty well versed in The Holy Bible, but I dont recall reading that. Can you help me??:)

It's ok, my peace-loving Talmud apparently says YOU need to die.

Now the above, I can probably give you chapter and verse, and may do it later. :)

So, isn't religion grand? The #1 source of ALL KILLING MOTIVATION
ON EARTH.

So now your saying your not religious? Are you, or are you not?

Ok, I gave you an answer. Now I'm ignoring you and your hate speach
forever.

Hate speech? Actually, I was being nice. :) I want us to build a bridge of better understanding, and you refuse to, why is that? You are the one thats getting all hatefull, all I asked you to do is to back up your statements, which you have not done. And you will not, will you? Here is some "Hate Speech"

<!--QuoteBegin-stooxie@Sep 16 2005, 12:15 AM
Hey, GOOD NEWS! The protestants don't have to because the CATHOLICS BEAT THEM TO IT!!!!!

Stop worring about Jews and go after your own pediphile Christian brothers. When was the last time the news papers blew a HUGE scandal about Jews being child molesters?

Sword, I love reading your posts, learning the Word of Christ.[color=red] I just keep stocking more and more ammo every time I do.....It's ok, you've got your guns, we've got ours....
-Stooxie
[/quote]

</span>-
stooxie=Sep 16 2005, 03:56 PM
I'm just letting you know: hate whom you like, because the scripture says so,
but just know that what goes around comes around.


Now I'm ignoring you...
...forever

Really? Forever? Oy Vey!!!! I'm all BUSTED UP!! :( :lol: :lol: Like I'm gonna miss being threatened. :lol: :lol:

(even though I know you'll post about 800 lines of scripture to show...
well, something.
-Stooxie

You prove my point so well I dont need 800 lines of nothing, you would do alot better just using the Ignore button. :lol: For someone who brags about being so darn smart, with all your "Degrees", you sure do step in it alot. :lol:

I bet you hate my stinking guts, dont ya? :lol: :lol: Thats ok, it dont hurt! :lol:

[Swordslinger]

Final legislation as it was passed by both House, and Senate.

H.J.Res.104


One Hundred Second Congress of the United States of America

AT THE FIRST SESSION
Begun and held at the City of Washington on Thursday, the third day of January,

one thousand nine hundred and ninety-one

Joint Resolution

To designate March 26, 1991, as `Education Day, U.S.A.'.

Whereas Congress recognizes the historical tradition of ethical values and principles which are the basis of civilized society and upon which our great Nation was founded;

Whereas these ethical values and principles have been the bedrock of society from the dawn of civilization, when they were known as the Seven Noahide Laws; Whereas without these ethical values and principles the edifice of civilization stands in serious peril of returning to chaos;

Whereas society is profoundly concerned with the recent weakening of these principles that has resulted in crises that beleaguer and threaten the fabric of civilized society;

Whereas the justified preoccupation with these crises must not let the citizens of this Nation lose sight of their responsibility to transmit these historical ethical values from our distinguished past to the generations of the future;

Whereas the Lubavitch movement has fostered and promoted these ethical values and principles throughout the world;

Whereas Rabbi Menachem Mendel Schneerson, leader of the Lubavitch movement, is universally respected and revered and his eighty-ninth birthday falls on March 26, 1991;

Whereas in tribute to this great spiritual leader, `the rebbe', this, his ninetieth year will be seen as one of `education and giving', the year in which we turn to education and charity to return the world to the moral and ethical values contained in the Seven Noahide Laws; and Whereas this will be reflected in an international scroll of honor signed by the President of the United States and other heads of state: Now, therefore, be it


Resolved by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That March 26, 1991, the start of the ninetieth year of Rabbi Menachem Schneerson, leader of the worldwide Lubavitch movement, is designated as `Education Day, U.S.A.'. The President is requested to issue a proclamation calling upon the people of the United States to observe such day with appropriate ceremonies and activities.
Speaker of the House of Representatives.

Vice President of the United States and

President of the Senate.


According to this, it must be more than the 0.001 % as mentioned above. This movement is not as small as "some" here would have you believe.

http://www.public-action.com/x/nh-jp-berger/



http://www.noahide.com/courts.htm
One of the "laws" is: Prohibition of Failing to Establish Courts of Justice
Without having a means to enforce the Laws, we would be unable to maintain social order and provide for the good of humanity. Therefore, the existence of courts of justice is necessary to enforce G-d's commandments.... The Seven Laws are an intrinsic part of G-d's blueprint for creation; they serve as the foundation of moral behavior that promote the well- being of all. This fact has been recognized by the U.S. government in a 1991 Congressional resolution stating that "...ethical values and principles have been the bedrock of society from the dawn of civilization, when they were known as the Seven Noahide Laws; ...The Seven Laws must be the basis of our legal system, and we need courts to enforce these laws.
While we are currently unable to establish such courts to enforce the Seven Laws, we can meanwhile accomplish this mitzvah by teaching others of the Laws. Only when people have this knowledge can they act to fulfull their role in G-d's plan for Creation.




"The difference between a Jewish and a non-Jewish person stems from the common expression: 'Let us differentiate.' Thus, we do not have a case of profound change in which a person is merely on a superior level. Rather, we have a case of 'let us differentiate' between Ýtotally different species. This is what needs to be said about the body: the body of a Jewish person is of a totally different quality from the body of members of all nations of the world ... A non-Jew's entire reality is only vanity. The entire creation of a non-Jew exists only for the sake of the Jews."
----Rabbi Menachem Scheerson, the chief rabbi of Chabad
Lest Ye think this is a quote from a nobody in a fringe movement, when is th e last time a finge movement nobody recieved this:

A.,
Washington Report of Middle East Affairs,
MARCH 2000,
p. 105-106
Incredibly, in 1995, the American Congress posthumously awarded Rabbi Menachem Schneerson, head of the Chabad Orthodox movement, the Congressional Gold Medal -- "the country's highest civilian honor." U. S. Senators and "more than 20 ambassadors and othe embassy officials" attended the dinner honoring Schneerson.

Baltimore Jewish Times, of Rabbi Schneerson said...
"was the first religious figure to get the coveted medal, which was approved
by Congress last October. More than a year of intensive lobbying by Chabad
forces generated some 225 House co-sponsors of the authorizing legislation.
Copies of the gold medal -- which was underwritten by donations from admirers of Rabbi Schneerson -- are being sold by the Treasury Department. According to
Washington sources, that could be a big moneymaker for the federal government."--James Besser,
Washington Honors Lubavitcher Rabbi,
Baltimore Jewish Times,
June 6, 1995, p. 32


How is such a small fringe element going to make this "medal" a big money maker for the federal government? Do you realize how much money it would take for this to be considered a "big money maker"? Do you believe that they would have even stuck it for a small "fringe" group? Fact is, this is much bigger than they would have the goyim to believe. THINK!!!!

Wake up America!!! Start asking questions. Dont just swallow everything you hear, research it. Find out if its true. Your children have to live here after you are gone. Take some responsibility and look about you to see whats happening. The very ones shouting "sepparation of church and state" are the very ones working dilligently behind the scenes to create thier own "theocracy", all the while refusing to allow you to say Jesus Christ, or Christmas in public without fear of being called a hater, or acused of "hate speech".

A little tip for ya for free. When someone tries to hide their religious teachings from public view, you need to take a hard look at that group to find out what they are trying to hide from you. Your life, and the lives of your posterity could depend on it.

[Tunug]

Originally posted by stooxie@Oct 28 2005, 02:02 PM
... So, isn't religion grand? The #1 source of ALL KILLING MOTIVATION
ON EARTH....

Bare with me ya'll and follow this, it will only take a moment.

Religion is one thing... absolute truth, the REAL Truth, is another thing entirely.

Religion is man's attempt to understand real truth... and because of the evil that men are born into, this interpretation of truth evolves into doctrines which are then abused as they are used to lord over other men, in an attempt to steal power for themselves -- become gods. This is where, and why we see evil being done in the name of all religions, even the religion created by men and labeled "christianity"

Real Christianity is not a religion, it is simply faith in Jesus Christ who is the only Way, Truth, and Life. This faith is life changing; and it takes little effort, because it is God who changes our heart. We can not do it alone or only with "religion."

yes, religion has done some serious harm throughout history -- I hate religion as well. But, who would condemn the only glint of real honest goodness that has ever been found quietly nestled within any type of religion? -- the Way taught by Jesus Christ, who physically, bodily rose from death and will be back soon. (and I challenge anyone to prove this false, because the evidence is so irrefutable that nobody in 2,000 years has ever been able to prove this false. Most who have tried have ended up believers, and those who say otherwise haven't honestly begun to search for any proof either way.)

The problem that most people have with real Christianity is NOT that they have tried it and found they don't like it, but that they have decided beforehand that it is too difficult and never actually tried it!

its a sad excuse

I have noticed that my brother, Swordslinger, is far from religious, but continually and honestly searches for and adheres to the Way that Jesus Christ gave us -- the only real hope for mankind. You put Sword on ignore because you have put Jesus on ignore.

Stooxie, why just put sword on ignore?

if you hate religion so much, it would be better to just outright ignore this whole religion forum.... or are you just a gluton for antagonism?

Wanna know what is not fair?

somebody stole my brothers car and then ran a man down and killed him with it. The police came to my brothers house and accused him of murder. My brother said, "it was not me! someone stole my car and did it, it was not me!" but the police said, "it must have been you because it we saw that it was your car!" So they tried and killed my brother for a crime he did not commit -- he had done nothing wrong!

taking all the evils that have come from all the world's religions and laying them at Christ's feet, the only perfect man that ever walked this earth. it is not His fault;

THAT is not fair!

and then using that as an excuse to spit in His face. It's a very lame excuse, and it will get you nowhere in your end but damn your own soul to eternal death.

All this after He died for YOU!

He IS alive and He knows your thoughts at this very moment.
Will you think about Him for a moment?
Or will you also ignore Him?

From the beginning of history men have wanted to become gods.
This year, let's celebrate the day that God became a man and conquered death by dieing in our place for our sin and rising again to come back and rule in righteousness! He is the ONLY hope for mankind!

[Metaldoc]

Well said, Tunug !

Amen & Amen.

[stooxie]

Originally posted by Tunug@Oct 30 2005, 05:47 PM
I have noticed that my brother, Swordslinger, is far from religious, but continually and honestly searches for and adheres to the Way that Jesus Christ gave us -- the only real hope for mankind. You put Sword on ignore because you have put Jesus on ignore.

Stooxie, why just put sword on ignore?

if you hate religion so much, it would be better to just outright ignore this whole religion forum.... or are you just a gluton for antagonism?
I don't hate religion. I guess I'm just tired of all the suspician
and fear that occurs from one group disagreeing with another.

Honestly, the reason I harass SwordSlinger so much is because
I am afraid that one day I will suddenly be on someone's
[s]hitlist for no other reason than my not being of the same
religion. I feel like I have to defend myself, or people of my
religion. I don't want these "discussions" to spiral out of control
into a full-fledged phobia that people develop. If you believe
some of these posts at face value then you'd think Jews (or
whoever) are all a bunch of blood sucking homo's looking to
take over politics, your familiy and everything else.

I take offense to that in the same way good Christians take
offense to being labeled child molesters. Not because any
one group is innocent, but because of they way extreme
examples are taken to be mainstream.

I just feel like I hear a lot of anti-semetic and anti-lots-of-things
talk when what I feel like everyone needs is just to relax a
little. To me, threads like this one are just fanning the fires
intolerance and hatred. What good does that achieve? How does
that help one be a good Christian or a good anything?

Anyway, thanks for not blasting away at me and actually asking
a reasonable question.

-Stooxie

[AR15_Fanatic]

Christmas get abolished?!?!?!?! Oh well, I guess we'll have to find another quaint pagan holiday to turn Christian, then ruin with greed and commercialism.

How does Easter soun...Oh wait! That's right. We already did it with the bunny and the eggs thing. Damn.

How about the 4th of July? See if we can find some Christian sect somewhere who believes that Jesus shoots off fireworks this time of the year. Yeah, that's it. There's the next holiday to ruin for everyone.

[Tunug]

God blesses those who bless Isreal. God does not change!

Its interesting that the word Jew can mean a lot of things. There is the race of Jews, there is the politics of Jews, there is the religion of Jews, there are Jews who are brothers in Christ and there are the Jews who reject Christ......

Christ was a Jew.

Jews are God's first and chosen people, and Christ came for the jews and the gentiles so the whole world can be a part of God's family.

Christ even commanded his disciples to go out and preach the gospel first to the Jew and then to the gentile because it is very important that the finished work of God that is accomplished by coming to earth as a man to take the penalty of death for us be understood and held sacred with the Jews who God has always loved. For, if it is not accepted by the Jews, what witness is that to the gentiles?

Yep, Jews get a bad rep, just like Christians get a bad rep, but we are God's family, brothers in Christ. It is the nature of this evil world to come against the Jew and the Christian -- those who will follow the real Truth are the ONLY real threat to the evil one. The world doesn't understand the Jews... the world doesnt understand the Christians.

I don't care what they want to say about the Christian and the Jew, because since Christ lives, we shall also live!

When this first and short trial of a life is over, I hope to one day meet you as a brother in Christ!

God bless ya Stoox!

can I make a suggestion? check out the audio links I put in the topic I started about the life of Christ.... forget about religions and take a look at the realness of Christ.... see what you really think of it.

[Swordslinger]

Originally posted by AR15_Fanatic+Oct 31 2005, 03:11 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (AR15_Fanatic @ Oct 31 2005, 03:11 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'>Christmas get abolished?!?!?!?!* Oh well, I guess we'll have to find another quaint pagan holiday to turn Christian, then ruin with greed and commercialism.

[/b]
I dont think it is as much the holiday as it is the Name of Christ. If we would settle for "X-mas", then His Name would "be bloted out" and they would be happy.

"The Hebrew form of the name Jesus--Yeshu--was interpreted as an acronym for the curse, 'may his name and memory be wiped out,' which is used as an extreme form of abuse. --Dr. Israel Shahak, Jewish History, Jewish
Religion, pp. 97- 98, 118."

I am the last one to claim Christmas has true Christian origins. It is a very old European American tradition that celebrated the comeing of the Christ. I have photos of olgam (ancient Irish) script found on rocks in West Virgina that mention the Christmas holiday maybe 500 years before Columbus so called discovered the new world. But....God in all of His infinite wisdom took a holiday of pagans celebrating the birth of Mithras, and caused the Holy Conception of God made flesh to happen on or about December 25. Further illustrating that true "life" begins at conception. You must admit that there is a big push to destroy anything and everything Christian and European American, and where the that attack is, there will stand I, in the gap, by what ever means I possibly can.
As far as why post something exposing these folks who wish to abolish Christmas?

Well, it is my duty as a Christian to be a watchmen on the wall. When we continue to help the wicked, as love those who hate the Lord, we bring wrath upon our people.

2nd Chronicles 19:2 ".....Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the LORD? therefore is wrath upon thee from before the LORD."

And as our "lawmakers" hold this certain sect of Judaism up as good, pass laws that favor them over Christians, (all the while chanting separation of church and state) many lazy judeo-Christians will believe it, and the circle of wrath continues. What Christians need to remember is that we are playing chess here, not checkers.

Isaiah 5:20* Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

Stooxie,
Honestly, the reason I harass SwordSlinger so much is because
I am afraid that one day I will suddenly be on someone's
[s]hitlist for no other reason than my not being of the same
religion.

You may be able to fool some of these fellas, but not me. ;) As for you "harassing" me. :lol: Thats a laugh, and a big one. In fact, you have said somethings on here that indicate that YOU are the one thats making a list. I have no fear of you, of the JDL, JDO or anyone else. Christ not only came to save me from my wretched wicked sins, but also from my enemies.

Luke 1:71 "That we should be saved from our enemies, and from the hand of all that hate us;"


You do nothing more than give me the very platform by which to expose those who openly declare hatred for Christ and for Christians. In fact, I havnt even posted any of the stuff that is taught about Christ, and Christians thats in the Talmud. If you truley mean what you say, why is it you come to the defense of those who do these things? You dont hear any of the Christians on here defending the pedophile priest of the Catholic church, do you?? I think I know why.
I take offense to that in the same way good Christians take
offense to being labeled child molesters.
Yet you are one of the first ones here to compare all Christians to the pervert priests, if I recall correctly. <_< Shall I go back and quote you? I didnt say all jews believed this. But I did prove that it is much bigger than anyone here could imagine. In fact, here is what I said:
Swordslinger Oct 27 2005, 05:46 PM
This thread was only to discuss the Jewish Suppremist flier on Christmas. I know not everyone of them follow and believe these things, just as not all Catholics and Christians are child molestors.

stooxie Posted on Oct 31 2005, 02:33 AM
To me, threads like this one are just fanning the fires
intolerance and hatred.

Intolerance and hatred? Lets look at the item we are discussing again in case you forgot....Hmmmm

Campaign to abolish X-mas
celebration by gentiles

Noahide Mivtzaiim materials now available. Anyone interested in obtaining holiday fliers (@ $.25 each) to distribute to their non-Jewish associates, please contact Shmuel or Aaron for more info:

[phone number withheld] www.noahide.com


Why Torah obligates all Jews in this campaign:

"...according to the known Jewish ruling that Christians are idol worshippers." (Likkutei Sichos 37:198)

A gentile...is liable for the death penalty...if he has invented a religious holiday for himself...The general principle is we do not allow them to make new religious rituals and to make 'mitzvahs' for themselves by their own devices. Rather they may either become a Ger Tzeddek and accept all the Mitvahs; or he (the Noahide) should stand fast in his Torah (the seven Noahide Laws) without adding or diminishing...and if he does make some new 'mitzvah,' we lash him, punish him, and inform him that he is obligated with the death penalty for this..." (Rambam Mishne Torah—Hilchos Melachim 10:9)

"...it is however obvious that if it will be perceived by them (the nations), also the matter of the negation of sh**uf, until they even have some recognition of the Unity of Hashem—that 'there is nothing else besides Him'; this will add both in their carefulness and meticulousness in fulfilling the seven Noahide Laws [with all of their ramifications!] and also in their aiding of Jewish people in all of their matters pertaining to Yiddishkeit and all of their needs in general..." (Likkutei Sichos 25: YudTes Kislev)

"Any person who has already worked successfully in this area should try to influence other Jews to do likewise. Resistance should not deter one when attempting to influence a further individual to accept upon himself the task of disseminating the Noahide Laws amongst the nations." (Hisvaduyos 5750 2:18-19)
But, since these guys are jewish, it dosnt count as "intolerance and hatred" huh? You should quit while you are ahead.
Intolerance and hatered huh? Kinda like this?
<!--QuoteBegin-stooxie@Sep 16 2005, 12:15 AM
Hey, GOOD NEWS! The protestants don't have to because the CATHOLICS BEAT THEM TO IT!!!!!

Stop worring about Jews and go after your own pediphile Christian brothers. When was the last time the news papers blew a HUGE scandal about Jews being child molesters?

Sword, I love reading your posts, learning the Word of Christ. I just keep stocking more and more ammo every time I do [/quote]
.....It's ok, you've got your guns, we've got ours....
-Stooxie

stooxie--Oct 31 2004, 02:23 AM
...these are fighting words in my book.
My people are the "chosen ones" so I can claim my God is watching out for me
every bit as you can claim yours is watching out for you.


Stooxie, if you really do not agree with the behavior of this group, why dont you just refute them? You have seen that I have not quoted anything that was not of a jewish source, to reduce the risk of someone excusing me of quoting "anti-semitic" litterature. You should be able to handle someone playing as fair as I am. Help us understand. That way we can build a bridge to better understanding of each others faith.

[Swordslinger]

Originally posted by Tunug@Oct 31 2005, 04:23 AM
God blesses those who bless Isreal. God does not change!


Very true. The only thing is that we have had the wool pulled over our eye as to who Israel is. Here is a quote from 1980 Jewish Almanac from an articl entitled; Identiy Crisis.

Strictly speaking, it is incorrect to call an ancient Israelite a "Jew" or to call a contemporary Jew an "Israelite" or a "Hebrew." "IDENTITY CRISIS," The Jewish Almanac , compiled and edited by Richard Siegel and Carl Rheins (New York, NY: Bantam Books, 1980) p. 3

"EDOM IS IN MODERN JEWRY."The Jewish Ency. 1925 edition, Vol. 5, p. 41,

…in the days of John Hyrcanus (end of the second century B.C.E.) … the [non-Israelite] Edomites became a section of the Jewish people. "EDOM," Encyclopaedia Judaica (Jerusalem, Israel: Encyclopaedia Judaica Company, 1971) Vol. 6, p. 378


They [the non-Israelite Edomites] were then incorporated with the Jewish nation…. "EDOM, IDUMEA," The Jewish Encyclopedia (New York & London: Funk and Wagnalls Company, 1904) Vol. V, p. 41
…from then on they [the non-Israelite Edomites] constituted a part of the Jewish people, Herod [King of Judea] being one of their descendants. "EDOM (Idumea)," The New Standard Jewish Encyclopedia (Garden City, NY: Doubleday & Company, Inc., 1977) p. 589


…they [the Edomites] were hereafter no other than [non-Israelite] Jews. Flavius Josephus, The Antiquities of the Jews (Grand Rapids, MI: Dregel Publications, 1960) Book XIII, Chapter IX, Verse 1, p. 279

Another good book that brings much of this to light is; The Thirtenth Tribe, written in the 1960s by Arthur Keostler, a Jewish man. Here are some quotes about his book;
DATELINE U.S.A. (1977) -- In 1976 Random House published a book that should have hit the Christian Churches like a blockbuster, but instead they chose totally to ignore it. It dealt with the racial origin of the people in Communist and Christian countries who call themselves "Jews," and whom the Churches (and the Jews themselves) generally insist are "God's Chosen People," the Israelite descendants of Abraham. Since the late 1800's a small number of Bible Scholars, who were also students of History and Racial origins, have insisted the Church denominations were wrong; that instead of being Israelites, these Jews from Eastern Europe and Western Asia were descended from Mongolians and other Asiatic peoples who had adopted Judaism as their "religion" over 1,000 years ago and had become know as "Jews." These Bible scholars were ignored or condemned, and often called "cultists" or "anti-Semites."

Now, after many years of research, a well-known Jewish author, Arthur Koestler has published a 255 page book titled THE THIRTEENTH TRIBE in which he proves the same point; i.e. that these Eastern European "Jews" are neither Israelites nor "Semites," but are instead Khazars, Mongols, and Huns! Most major newspapers and magazines reviewed the book during 1976. Also, Random House, the publisher, advertised it extensively and began some of their ads with the following headline: WHAT IF MOST JEWS AREN'T REALLY SEMITES AT ALL? In addition, Random House quoted the following reviews:

"Mr. Koestler's excellent book...Is as readable as it is thought-provoking. Nothing could be more stimulating than the skill, elegance and erudition with which he marshals his facts and develops his theories..." Fitzroy Maclean, New York Times Book Review.

"You do not have to be Jewish to be interested... Are today's Western Jews really ethnic, Semitic, Biblical Jews, or are most of them descendants of converted Khazars?...This compact, interesting book...examines tragic-ironic implications in [this question] for modern history...It should fascinate." --Edmund Fuller, Wall Street Journal

"Koestler marshals the evidence in a clear and convincing way. He tells a good story, pulling together materials from medieval Muslims and Jewish travelers, scholarly controversy and the mysterious lore of the Khazars." --Raymond Sokolov, Newsweek



God does not lie. Flavius Jocephus wrote of the 10 northern tribes that were cast off, "were beyond the pass (Caucasus Mountain Range) and are now an immense multitude." Those people, referred to as "sheep" all through out Scrtipture settled the European continents, kept the Monarchy, and followed after false gods, just as they had been divorced for doing. They went to the west and to the north, as the Scripture says. They were the "Lost sheep of the House of Israel that Christ said He came for;
Matthew 15:24* But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.

Those are who He sent His Apostles and followers to reach:
Matthew 10:6* But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Because it was those sheep that would hear His voice and become Christians.
John 10:27* My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
And those sheep where the Scattered flock, sent into the Assyrian Captivity in 745 BC.
John 10:16* And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold: them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one fold, and one shepherd.

And those that "heard His voice" and became Christian continue to spread, and become a great imense multitude in number, just as the prophecy given to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob/Israel. The place spoken of in 2nd Samuel 7:10 would need to come to be soon. And then....the greatest mass migration every to take place in history. These people flocked to the Noth American Continent, the land with an "eastern sea" and a "western sea" just as prophecied. A land of "unwalled villiages", and "meeted out" divided by rivers, just as prophecied. All these fit the description of the "New JerUSAlem". And the time we are in now is due to the very laziness, and misleading by **** poor shepards who have sold out for the buck, and PC/BS fear of being called a name, I mentioned in the above post;
Micah 4:10* Be in pain, and labour to bring forth, O daughter of Zion, like a woman in travail: for now shalt thou go forth out of the city, and thou shalt dwell in the field, and thou shalt go even to Babylon;.
Thats where we are now, both spiritually, as well as physically. We have soldier standing on the land once known as Babylon, that will never return home. Spiritually, we are back in Babylon, as where our forefathers, being oppressed. But there is GOOD NEWS in the latter part of this prophecy.

there shalt thou be delivered; there the LORD shall redeem thee from the hand of thine enemies

Praise Jesus Christ!!!

True. If we bless true Israel, we will be blessed. But if we bless Esau/Edom, even if he says he is Israel, and convinced the real Israel that they are not, the wrath still comes upon us. ;)


Amen God does not change!!!

[SPARTEN117]

i wouldn't worry about it. theis @$$ holes probobly live in thair mom's basment :huh:

[stooxie]

Originally posted by SPARTEN117@Oct 31 2005, 05:39 AM
i wouldn't worry about it. theis @$$ holes probobly live in thair mom's basment :huh:
Thank you! Couldn't have said it better...

-Stooxie

[Tunug]

Originally posted by SPARTEN117@Oct 31 2005, 08:39 AM
i wouldn't worry about it. theis @$$ holes probobly live in thair mom's basment :huh:
Well, since you think you are so much better than we whom you don't even know, please enlighten us on what success really is.

(And this time, refer to your mom's dictionary, so your spelling doesn't give away your intelligence) <wink>

[SPARTEN117]

ok ya my spelling is not great. i said nothing about you[ unless you think Jesus's birthday should disapeer] or Sward slinger who i highly respect. success is any thing that god has called you too, liveing in you mom's basment is not one of thoes things . the great comition tells us to "go out and make diciples of all people". not worry about how their sellebrating christmas. jews are God's people and Christians are Jesus Christ's people, read Holy Trinity father[GOD], son[JESUS CHRIST], and holy spirit, they are 1!
now for my non-Christian response :sniper:

[stooxie]

Originally posted by Tunug+Oct 31 2005, 07:54 AM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (Tunug @ Oct 31 2005, 07:54 AM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin-SPARTEN117@Oct 31 2005, 08:39 AM
i wouldn't worry about it. theis @$$ holes probobly live in thair mom's basment :huh:
Well, since you think you are so much better than we whom you don't even know, please enlighten us on what success really is.

(And this time, refer to your mom's dictionary, so your spelling doesn't give away your intelligence) <wink> [/b][/quote]
Alright folks, break it up, break it up!

Actually, Tunug has clued me in to how I might have been misinterpreting SwordSlinger.

SwordSlinger is trying to point out groups that unfairly denounce Christianity. He and
I are both trying to defend the "good" folks out there. We just sorta do it differently.
SwordSlinger uses his vast recollection of the bible to provide evidence and I point
out what I see which, in my estimation, is no less valid.

-Stooxie

[SPARTEN117]

I got that.

[Tunug]

<passes out candy> :D

[ShootinDave]

This is stupid. Go out and read your own religious scripts and we will read ours. This thread is no place to preach your discomfort of a theology before the world. WRIGHT A BOOK.

Christianity has caused more wars....... SO WHAT!? Read The Bible it will make since. Rejoice, Repent..... but before all else SHUT UP!

This forum is not the top of the mountin to preach. It is a friendly community of people with similar ideas. Make your own thread.... so I can share YOUR IDEAS with you.


-Dave

(Sorry for the rant)

[Swordslinger]

http://www.catholicleague.org/05press_rele...051122_FGCU.htm (http://www.catholicleague.org/05press_releases/quarter%204/051122_FGCU.htm)

[Metaldoc]

This is plumb nuts ! And from what is supposed to be an institute of higher learning ? :o :(

We have a new sub species of humans........ intellectual idiots. :angry: