Ruger 10/22 Firing Pin

[gunrunner12]

Hi
would anyone recommend the Titanium Firing Pin, for the ruger 10/22?

I have had problems with the cheaper ammo, that 1 out of 5 bullets miss fires.

But when I use the same brand bullets on the pistol, it works great.

Question: would this Titanium firing pin fix the problem, or is it just a waste of time?

[cajungeo]

Hi gunrunner, I would not go for the titanium firing pin, as it has less mass, therefore less stricking energy. Possible solutions that come to mind: (1) the 10/22 comes with a preservative in the barrel/chamber. If you or the original owner did not first clean it before shooting, this will glaze over. The bullet is not seated all the way so the firing pin wastes stricking energy in driving the round into the chamber. Solution is to clean chamber with a new brush, and solvent, from the chamber end (yea, I know you will have to remove the barrel). Do not use an old brush. (2) Did you replace your hammer spring? The aftermarket springs are weaker, and do not have the striking power of the origional springs. Solution: Reinstall origional hammer spring. Let us know if this helps.

[gunrunner12]

Hi cajungeo

I will try cleaning the barrel but with winchester ammo, it works fine.

I have not changed the hammer spring, I purchased from new the 10/22

Question: I have taken the 10/22 apart, now I have the bolt in my hand, what tool do I use to get the firing spring out?

[cajungeo]

Hey gunrunner, not all 22 cal ammo is the same, I'm not surprised, some will fit down into the chamber, and some will not with a dirty chamber. You have to get that preservative out of there, it isn't oil.
I don't know why you want to take out your firing pin, but if you look at the part # on this diagram, we will be on the same wave length. Roll pin B-13 holds your firing pin, and spring in. If all you want to do is clean the barrel Remove 2 allen screws B-67 using a 5/32" allen wrench (no mm it is american SAE std) This will remove your V block B-66. Then just twist and pull, your barrel will come out of the receiver. Clean with a new bore brush, from the chamber end, and some solvent. You might want to first try droping in a troubling bullet to see how it fits before, and after cleaning ( use the bullet for a guage try several). It should drop right in. Reasemble, torquing the allen screws the same feel as when you broke them loose.
http://www.ontargetguns.com/1022.pdf

[gunrunner12]

Hi cajungeo

about this 10/22 I'm just thinking what I have changed in the past, now the only real thing is the spring, on your diagram is number B-48A, it cycles the bolt back & forth.

The spring was cut to make it easier for the subsonics to cycle. They cycle well in the rifle.

Now I have changed to high velocity the problems started, if I go back to subsonic again there is know problem.

I'm just thinking if the changing of the spring may have been the problem?

A lighter spring may? be a problem, for the bullets that are high velocity.

:rolleyes:

[cajungeo]

So now we have all the facts to work with. You nailed it gunrunner! If you cut the Spring, the firing pin will have a lighter strike. From articles I've read on the Subsonic it isn't as reliable in a semi Auto such as the 10/22. (1) The heavy round dosen't make it out of the barrel, before the gasses move the bolt rearward, so the case dosen't fill the chamber (fire forming), and there isn't enough gas yet to fully move bolt to rear. Also the POI will be lower because of gas leakage around the chamber. (2) I believe the 10/22 has a 16" rifling turn, the subsonic needs a 9" to stableize the 60gr bullet, therefore they are not accurate in a std 10/22. I know someone probably will have different experience.
Personally I would replace the stock spring, back like it was, and stick with HV ammo.

[LIKTOSHOOT]

Are you for real??? Do you even own a 10/22???? LTS

[gunrunner12]

Hi LIKTOSHOOT

What's LTS stand for?

[cajungeo]

Hi Liketoshoot, if you were talking to me, I have owned 3 10/22's. I sold the blued model, and currently own a 10/22 carbine, and a 10/22-22 rifle, both stainless, how about you? Do you have anything thing to contribute concerning shooting subsonics, in a 10/22? I have not fired any personally, and as I stated earlier, I have read articles and other posts on the subject. I have found a couple others that like the accuracy they get, and have no ejection problems, but they seem to be in the minority. One of my buddies at work shot some in his 10/22, nothing but jams, and their wasn't enough gas left in that short round to be accurate. I believe they would be much better in a bolt gun. We appreciate hearing from you even if your post is only a snide remark, what we really would like is if you could give the gunrunner some usuable info on his current problem.;)

[gunrunner12]

Hi cajungeo

glad to see you here.

Last thursday I purchased the spring, well I had to buy the hole cocking system but at 15 American dollars, this was not a problem.

I went to the club & the problems are solved. if I every go back to subsonic I will put the other cocking device in.

I live in New Zealand & 50% of all 10/22 are subsonic, people use this ammo because it's silent & we can have fun without people that know nothing about guns, calling the police.

We have many people that are hobby farmers, never shot a gun in there life.

The subsonic is great ammo, the last 2 years I have used it, but for 50 yards there is a problem, accuracy is lost.

The bullet seems to fall 2-3 inches. 50 yards.

Accuracy at 25 metters is great.

Yes I agree, bolt action would be best but we have many possums to take out, would be very slow.

:ar15:

[cajungeo]

Hey gunrunner, you might find someone wanting to sell their 10/22 cheep, and buy it. Set one up to work with the subsonics, and the other with Hi velocity, or std velocity ammo. I am building one rifle for a very accurate hunting rifle, to shoot off hand for squirrel, rabbit, and neutra rats. The other is for long range target i.e. 200 yds or behond shooting from a bench rest or bipods.
I figured you were using the subsonic for the quietness, as I remembered your surpresser on your mini-14. Good shooting.

[LIKTOSHOOT]

cajungeo, yes I own several 10/22`s, as in more than one......

I build custom 10`22`s....mostly for hunters.

Cutting the recoil spring for subsonic reliability is not smart. I have yet to see one that won`t cycle subs.....but I guess, there`s always the exception to the rule. Considering that Remington subs are about 1050fps and this is only about 150fps off standard shelf ammo, I doubt the problem is the ammo, unless it is below 900fps and if so......I would like some.

Now, firing this modified rifle with HV ammo and it fails to operate correctly, is simply. The spring is too weak and allowing the bolt to overtravel at a higher rate of speed, this will cause many problems....one being failure to fire. This is caused by a rebounding bolt. [The bolt is traveling so fast, when it closes...it bounces out of battery a small amount] This will certainly damage the gun over time. You will find the bolt stop pin will begin to show slop and fall out on it`s own.....without a punch or drift required. It will also cause gauling on the barrel face....among other problems, such as undue trigger and sear wear.

Cutting the recoil spring has little to do with how hard the firing pin strikes. Though the titainium firing pin is lighter, the mass is greater, thereby creating more friction in the bolt slot rail for it. Polishing the sides of the firing pin will relieve this problem. Remember the titainium firing pin is lighter, so it does not have the same inertia as the factory firing pin when struck. Several trigger components can be stoned, once done.....this will allow for lighter trigger and hammer springs to become a reliable shooter. Factory trigger and hammer springs are way overpowered for the hammer and trigger let-off. Mine are set to 1.5lbs with no creap or overtravel.....but can be set lighter or heavier (fixed).


I have one (10/22) that is set-up for .22 shorts only too, but that`s another story......very quite! LTS

[cajungeo]

Thanks LTS for sharing your experteese with us. So in the gunrunner case he should replace the cut spring with a new one, which will put him back to his origional problemThe spring was cut to make it easier for the subsonics to cycle. So how do we make it cycle better in his rifle? I have read from other sources that firing a brick of ammo thru a new 10/22 will loosen things up some. Do you have a fix for the cycle problem?
LTS you mentioned your trigger job is 1 1/2 lb, I was going to replace my hammer with a volquartsen which is said to reduce the trigger pull to 2 1/2 lb, what do you recomend to get it down another pound? A reduced trigger spring? I can't afford the Volquartsen drop in trigger unit.
Hey gunrunner do you have a bolt buffer? It will save you a lot of grief later!
We appreciate your help LTS, We are new to tuning the 10/22, like we were to the mini, but we learn a new trick each day.

[gunrunner12]

Hi cajungeo

about the mini 14 surpresser, it's very hard to make a center fire rifle, noise free. For me impossible I found.

The only rifle caliber that I have seen that has no noise ( very little ) nothing outside say 15 meters is the .22 subsonic & the .45ACP Yes we have rifles that are made for .45acp

But both bullets are short range.

In my H&K USP45 pistol, the velocity 1100 feet per second, the second shot was 1104 feet per second.

My understanding is that the .45acp should be between 800 to 1000 ft, but I was wrong.

About the cuting of the 10/22 spring, that's what we do here, our gun dealer does the same thing, it works well.




:2guns:

[LIKTOSHOOT]

I am curious why the recoil spring needs to be cut to start with. I use an aftermarket recoil spring, which are much stronger than the factory spring. It cycles subs and HV ammo with complete reliability. I would like to know what ammo your using that requires lesser spring weight, to make it reliable. These loads must be under 900fps, or close to that and even that is questionable. My .22 short "only" 10/22 uses a lighter spring and bolt for reliability......but it is shooting shorts only, and these run 775 to 950fps.

Even the .22 ASSS will cycle in mine, with the 60grainer.

Back later for your trigger work........LTS

[gunrunner12]

LIKTOSHOOT

I had a look, to try & find the ammo that I first used, when I purchased that rifle about two or three years ago.

The ammo name I could not find, but I know that it' was the cheapest on the market at that time.

I can look at the gun club, to see what the name was, but I go on a thursday.

The ammo that I changed to, was winchester subsonic, I found it to be more accurate than the first.

The modification to the spring, depends on what you have done, some people send there 10/22 into a gun smith & fully surpress it, the cost is $200 american.

surpressed 10/22 the gun smith cuts the barrel down to around 12 to 13 inches, this means that the timing of the bullet gas has changed & the bullet will have problems with the cycle, stov pipe is massive.

I was thinking to do this, but I could not justify $200 American.

I only put a silencer on the end.

I'm not a gun smith, the gun dealer told me to cut the spring, so I cut the spring 3 in, this worked but I was told by another guy at that time, do not cut to much off, as you will not be able to use high velocity. Remember this was years ago.

[LIKTOSHOOT]

I believe these gunsmiths are blowing smoke where the sun don`t shine. I have shot several different suppressed 10/22`s and several 77/22`s over the years.....each of a different maker and suppressor styles. I have never seen the recoil guiderod spring cut for reliability on a 10/22. Not that some may not do it, OR think it may be needed......think is the key word. I have experimented with short and long barrels on these, all the way down to eight inches, with no loss of reliability of feeding or ejection.

I still believe it to be ammo related, as opossed to the recoil spring and the reason for this is, I don`thave the exact weight for the ruger factory recoil spring......but the ones we use are nearly a pound heavier than factory and cycle subs and HV with totalreliability. Theywill also shoot shorts.....but! they will only eject, it will not feed the next round......it must be done manually.

The suppressor should have very little efect on a 10" barrel and I know of one for sale now, thatthe complete barrel and suppresor is 10" in totallenght and it shoots subs......it is also.....FA


LTS

[gunrunner12]

One thing that I can say, is that the shorter the barrel, the less amount of time the bullet is within the barrel, & this in itself means the pressure is shorter in time.

[doonnzl]

Thought Id have a peek in here to see whats happening, seeing as how the enlightened folk seem to gather here with some dam good ideas etc....
Gunrunner, Ive been using both the winchester and remington subs, am now sticking with the winchester. Seems to be considerable more accurate, further.
Never cut the spring on my 10/22 for the subs but by the time I put a suppressor on it and started using sub rounds it had probably had 1000 rds thru it so the spring was quite weak already I spose.
A mate just invested in a new all weather 10/22 and he had the spring cut for the subs cos i wouldnt cycle about every third or fourth round, but the smithy said he'd be back after a few bricks for a stronger spring, but as far as I can see it just means the thing will always cycle(?).
I use the CCI minimags with or without the suppressor if I want punch and the winchester subs for hush, with good results. Even the misses has a good run with the subs on board, means shes not worried about the noise and kick (from a 10/22 !) and I can use the Mini!

BTW where bouts in NZ are ya?

[gunrunner12]

Hi doonnzl

I'm from Auckland NZ.

With the 10/22 you need to try most of the different ammo on the market, to get the best for your rifle.

I had used winchester subs for a long period of time, they are great. But the winchester ammo went up in price, so I had to change.

I now use only high velocity, because of the distance problems with the sub.

So you have a mini 14? great rifle they are.

about the 10/22 I have a new spring & alls well. Come to think about it, I may see how the subs work with it, just for a laugh, may cycle?

I was shooting shotgun in the weekend, this is recoil. We had a bolt action there too, it's a 8mm.

Are you from Auckland?








:ar15:

[doonnzl]

nah mate, freezing ma nuts off in CHCH.....

As I said B4, the non-cycling didnt happen all the time with the new rifle, and I use the winchester subs with my weak ass spring all the time, Have not had a prob yet....

My mini is in a million pieces at the moment while I fix a few issues, real keen to put it back together and go for another spray down the range !

Done all but two of the mods to my mini from this site so far with good results, so im keen to see if there is anything I desparatley need to do to the 10/22 for reliability.

You got a suppressor on ya 22?

[doonnzl]

dah, just opened my eyes and saw the answer to that !!

[gunrunner12]

Hi doonnzl

Yes I have a suppressor on the 10/22, just screw it on the end of the barrel.

About the mini 14, what have you modified?

Make shore you have a recoil buffer, you can make it up with a thick leather belt. Cost nothing & takes 5 minutes to put in.

Mini 14s are very simple, that's the key to any rifle or pistol.

[doonnzl]

Is this the right place to discuss this???:)

So far done the gas block lapping thing, Got a butler creek plastic stock for it (which apparently is in desparate need of bedding), Got a crown put on the end of the barrel cos I think, if there was one before, it was removed when the barrel was threaded for the suppressor (?),Got a 3-9x40 Tasco scope on a dodgy weaver mount (being fixed now), JR Laser, shortened the operating rod, and am currently awaiting 'Mike from Oregon's video and bush kit and buffer. That will be the end of mods....really.

Just for the record seeing as how we are in the 10/22 forum !!!

Ive done the buffer, put a ATI (?) druganov stock on the little fulla and again threaded for suppresor, extended mag release, 4x32 tasco scope and JR Laser. Real light, fun machine that the misses can easily use too. Certainly upset many a possy and fluffy bum with it...
Recoil buffer made a big difference (noise/shock) on the 10/22, hoping for a similar result in the Mini...