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Old 06-11-2010, 02:51   #1
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Cheap Trigger Solution or Not?

My BM AR15 stock trigger is OK, but has a slight, yet noticeable creep.
I hear a very inexpensive improvement in trigger action is to replace the original Trigger and Hammer pins with Non-Rotating pins.
Please advise.
What are the pin diameters?
Any suggestions?
Thanks for your help
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Old 06-11-2010, 04:32   #2
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I like to install the KNS anti-rotation pin sets in all Ar15s.
You need a .154 pin set.
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Old 06-11-2010, 07:22   #3
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Originally Posted by faawrenchbndr View Post
I like to install the KNS anti-rotation pin sets in all Ar15s.
You need a .154 pin set.
Thanks for your help!
I'll pick those up today and give it a try.
I've enjoyed shooting my handguns for 20 years. This new BM AR is so much fun, i wanted to take my hobby a bit further.
Hope this minor upgrade is a good starting point for a novice like myself, interested in further add-ons and/or repairs.
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Old 06-11-2010, 17:39   #4
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The pins won't help a lot with the trigger pull. What you can do is clean up and smooth the surfaces and install a lighter hammer spring. The Rock River 2 stage trigger is a favorite of AR owners and doen't bust the bank. I have 2 of them and they work great.
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Old 06-11-2010, 22:44   #5
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Originally Posted by Carbine85 View Post
The pins won't help a lot with the trigger pull. What you can do is clean up and smooth the surfaces and install a lighter hammer spring. The Rock River 2 stage trigger is a favorite of AR owners and doen't bust the bank. I have 2 of them and they work great.
Thanks for the reply.
Did you mean, Clean and Smooth my existing Hammer and Trigger Pins?
Is the RR 2 Stage Trigger job for a novice o gunsmither?
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Old 06-12-2010, 00:48   #6
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Is the RR 2 Stage Trigger job for a novice o gunsmither?
Yep, push out the pins, drop it in and reinstall the pins.
5 minute job.

You could also send your trigger parts to Bill Springfield and he'll do a good trigger job for about $60.

http://www.triggerwork.net/ar15s.html
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Old 06-12-2010, 03:33   #7
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Originally Posted by jampac View Post
Thanks for the reply.
Did you mean, Clean and Smooth my existing Hammer and Trigger Pins?
Is the RR 2 Stage Trigger job for a novice o gunsmither?
The RRA 2-stage trigger is a drop in for the exisitng. Anyone can put it in.
Or clean and smooth the hammer, notch and trigger. The lighter springs are available at Brownells. There is also a section in this forum on a quick trigger job.
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Old 06-12-2010, 03:55   #8
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oversize pins will make more of a difference in the trigger feel than the non rotating pins.
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Old 06-12-2010, 05:42   #9
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I too like the KNS ant-rotational pins, and I have them installed on most of my AR's. Firstly, they're functional, but IMHO they also compliment the aesthetics of the rifle.

Of course, they are indeed another "do-dad" for your rifle. So, why not? Right?

aawrenchbndr is correct on the size that you need to order (.154"). +1!

With regards to your question about "creep", I personally don't think the KNS pins would do the trick. I could be wrong, but the anti-rotational pins are just that...the stop the pins from rotating in the receiver, in order to mitigate any undue wear to the pin holes on the lower receiver.

Now, I do have a couple of suggestions:

#1 => As others have mentioned, the RRA National Match two-stage trigger is an exceptional trigger at a reasonable price. And, it's something a novice armorer can install (just take your time and ask questions if you get stuck).

If you go with a RRA NM two-stage trigger, you'll immediately notice a difference. Keep in mind that with a two-stage trigger, there there will be some "take-up" in the trigger, before the hammer releases. THIS IS BY DESIGN!

A two-stage trigger helps the shooter to gauge when the hammer will fall. In short, as the trigger reaches the second stage, you know the hammer will release with slight additional pressure.

Alternatively, with a single-stage trigger, you simply have to "know" your trigger's release point. And, this can be slightly more difficult to determine and/or train yourself to.

For some (like my brother, a military-guy and qualified expert marksman), a two-stage trigger is NOT preferred. For others, they swear by a two-stage trigger. So, the point is that it will come down personal preference. And...with practice...you can become a proficient shooter with each.

OK...sorry, I rambled there. Now onto the second suggestion.

#2 => Since I have replaced my factory triggers with either a Chip McCormick single-stage match trigger, or the Rock River Arms NM two-stage trigger, I have several factory triggers/hammers lying around in my gun case.

Anyway, I ran across a video on youTube regarding "tweaking" a factory AR-15 trigger, in order to remove the "take-up" in the trigger. So, I figured I'd give it a go. Again, I had some spare parts lying around. So, what the heck?

Now, over the winter I put together my recent AR-15 build, my Yote-Getter. So, I decided I would try this trigger modification for it, just to see if it worked.

Anyway, after doing the "mod" and working the hammer (as is shown in the video) the trigger was surprisingly crisp. It definitely took away the "slop/creep" you may experience with a standard/factory AR-15 trigger.

I've shot my Yote-Getter with this trigger job, and I thought it did quite well. Of course, it's not a "match" trigger, but for the price ($0), I was definitely impressed. In fact, I'm thinking of doing it again for a future AR-15 build.

So, if you're game, this might be a good...and CHEAP...option for you to consider.

As far as the difficulty scale (1-10), I'd rate this "mod" a 2 or 3. Again, just take your time and be patient.

Before I give you the video link, I have to offer a disclaimer.

Remember, you're modifying the fire control group in a high-powered rifle. This, by the very nature of this "mod", it can be very dangerous. More importantly, if you do something wrong, and you damage the functionality of the fire control group, this could lead to personal injury or death. (I'm not trying to scare you, but 'dems the facts.)

In other words, any modification made to your AR-15 fire control group should be done with great care. And, you should function-test the rifle as you go, as well as once it is fully assembled in a safe manner.

My apologies for the disclaimer, but keep in mind, if a "mod" breaks-bad on you, it can become a VERY serious matter for you or someone else. And, we don't want that, right?

OK...here's the link:

Click here

Also, there is a trigger job listed as a sticky in the AR-15 talk section:

Click here

Let us know how it goes.
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Last edited by alaj70; 06-12-2010 at 09:59.
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Old 06-19-2010, 21:06   #10
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Originally Posted by alaj70 View Post
I too like the KNS ant-rotational pins, and I have them installed on most of my AR's. Firstly, they're functional, but IMHO they also compliment the aesthetics of the rifle.

Of course, they are indeed another "do-dad" for your rifle. So, why not? Right?

aawrenchbndr is correct on the size that you need to order (.154"). +1!

With regards to your question about "creep", I personally don't think the KNS pins would do the trick. I could be wrong, but the anti-rotational pins are just that...the stop the pins from rotating in the receiver, in order to mitigate any undue wear to the pin holes on the lower receiver.

Now, I do have a couple of suggestions:

#1 => As others have mentioned, the RRA National Match two-stage trigger is an exceptional trigger at a reasonable price. And, it's something a novice armorer can install (just take your time and ask questions if you get stuck).

If you go with a RRA NM two-stage trigger, you'll immediately notice a difference. Keep in mind that with a two-stage trigger, there there will be some "take-up" in the trigger, before the hammer releases. THIS IS BY DESIGN!

A two-stage trigger helps the shooter to gauge when the hammer will fall. In short, as the trigger reaches the second stage, you know the hammer will release with slight additional pressure.

Alternatively, with a single-stage trigger, you simply have to "know" your trigger's release point. And, this can be slightly more difficult to determine and/or train yourself to.

For some (like my brother, a military-guy and qualified expert marksman), a two-stage trigger is NOT preferred. For others, they swear by a two-stage trigger. So, the point is that it will come down personal preference. And...with practice...you can become a proficient shooter with each.

OK...sorry, I rambled there. Now onto the second suggestion.

#2 => Since I have replaced my factory triggers with either a Chip McCormick single-stage match trigger, or the Rock River Arms NM two-stage trigger, I have several factory triggers/hammers lying around in my gun case.

Anyway, I ran across a video on youTube regarding "tweaking" a factory AR-15 trigger, in order to remove the "take-up" in the trigger. So, I figured I'd give it a go. Again, I had some spare parts lying around. So, what the heck?

Now, over the winter I put together my recent AR-15 build, my Yote-Getter. So, I decided I would try this trigger modification for it, just to see if it worked.

Anyway, after doing the "mod" and working the hammer (as is shown in the video) the trigger was surprisingly crisp. It definitely took away the "slop/creep" you may experience with a standard/factory AR-15 trigger.

I've shot my Yote-Getter with this trigger job, and I thought it did quite well. Of course, it's not a "match" trigger, but for the price ($0), I was definitely impressed. In fact, I'm thinking of doing it again for a future AR-15 build.

So, if you're game, this might be a good...and CHEAP...option for you to consider.

As far as the difficulty scale (1-10), I'd rate this "mod" a 2 or 3. Again, just take your time and be patient.

Before I give you the video link, I have to offer a disclaimer.

Remember, you're modifying the fire control group in a high-powered rifle. This, by the very nature of this "mod", it can be very dangerous. More importantly, if you do something wrong, and you damage the functionality of the fire control group, this could lead to personal injury or death. (I'm not trying to scare you, but 'dems the facts.)

In other words, any modification made to your AR-15 fire control group should be done with great care. And, you should function-test the rifle as you go, as well as once it is fully assembled in a safe manner.

My apologies for the disclaimer, but keep in mind, if a "mod" breaks-bad on you, it can become a VERY serious matter for you or someone else. And, we don't want that, right?

OK...here's the link:

Click here

Also, there is a trigger job listed as a sticky in the AR-15 talk section:

Click here

Let us know how it goes.
Thanks!
Info and vids were helpful.
appreciated
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